7 Lessons To Build A Life You Love – Season 5 Wrap

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So, we’ve reached the end of another eventful season! In this episode, I look back at 7 of the key lessons I’ve learned from this season including from conversations with Cal Newport, Sophie Medlin, Cliff Weitzman, Drs John and Julie Gottman, Mathew Dicks, Carrie Rose and Dr Aria. I also want to say a massive thank you to everyone who has supported the podcast so far, it really means a lot. If you’d like to keep in touch during the off-season, be sure to join our telegram community where you’ll get a behind the scene’s look at what me and the team are up to preparing for next season 🚀 But in the meantime, I hope you enjoy the episode 🙂

(00:00) Intro
(02:41) Sophie Medlin: How To Improve Your Brain Health
(11:54) Cliff Wietzman: How To Learn Anything Faster
(19:41) The Gottman’s: How To Improve Your Relationships
(30:54) Matthew Dicks: How To Reach Your Goals
(41:51) Carrie Rose: How To Be An A-Player At Work
(46:42) Dr Aria: How To Be Confident In Yourself
(57:51) Cal Newport: How To Design A Lifestyle You Want


S5 E8 Sophie Medlin –
S5 E5 Cliff Wietzman –
S5 E4 John & Julie Gottman –
S5 E13 Matthew Dicks –
S5 E10 Carrie Rose –
S5 E11 Dr Aria –
S5 E1 Cal Newport –


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Hey friends and welcome back to Deep Dive the weekly podcast where it's my Immense pleasure to sit down with Authors and academics and entrepreneurs And creators and other inspiring people And we find out how they got to where They are and what strategies and tools And principles we can learn from them to Help us build a life that we love now we Have reached the end of season five Already absolutely mental this podcast Has now been going on for the last year And a half which feels like an Absolutely long time but also feels like Just yesterday that we had the idea for The podcast and then had our first few Guests and kind of started getting the Ball rolling and figuring out how to Make a podcast how to do multi-cam edits How to do shorts for social media all of That fun stuff but the main benefit of The podcast is I feel like through Having all of these conversations which You guys have been very kindly listening To and watching and commenting on and Everything I've learned so much about Myself and so much that I've applied to My own life and my own business as well Now one of the things that I've been Really focusing on for this particular Season of the podcast is health and Relationships I think on the work front Most of what I read and consume and Listen to and watch anyway is business

And work related but I chronically under Best in my health and in relationships And in consuming content and learning About those sorts of things and so in Particular I took a lot of lessons away From the episode that we did with John And Julie gottman who are like one of The most famous people in the world when It comes to relationship advice and That's been super helpful and I've Already started applying some of the Stuff from that episode to my Relationship and then similarly in Improving the relationship that I have With myself the episode that I did with A psychologist Dr Arya felt more of a Therapy session than I did a podcast Episode and I took away so much from That and actually Dr Ari and I had a Kind of private coaching session Afterwards which we might release Because we filmed it at some point if You guys are potentially interested but That was also super valuable in kind of Helping me feel more self-confidence and More self-love as well now this episode Is going to be our usual end of season Roundup where we're going to play seven Different clips from seven different Episodes of the podcast for this last Season and these are specific actionable Takeaways that you can take from some of The episodes I'd also like to say a Massive thank you at this point to

Everyone who has signed up to podcast Who has subscribed on YouTube or on Spotify on iTunes or wherever you get Your podcast this season we hit 200 000 Drivers on the YouTube channel which is Absolutely insane and it's been really Nice and heartwarming getting comments Via email and the YouTube comments and Even on your telegram Community hearing How much some of you guys have enjoyed The podcast and the actionable takeaways You've taken from it on that note if you Would like to join our telegram Community it's completely free there'll Be a link down in the video description Or in the show notes depending on where You're watching or listening to this and That's where we post behind the scenes Stuff from the podcast and if I have a Guest coming on and curating questions From the audience the telegram Community Is where we go to get those questions Anyway that's enough talking from me Let's now roll the seven lessons for the Roundup of season five of the podcast I Hope you enjoy them at the moment According to the YouTube analytics 81 of You who are watching this on YouTube Have not yet hit the Subscribe button And so if you're for example in the now 81 of people who are watching this on YouTube but who are not subscribed to The channel I would love it if you could Do so and would be awesome to get that

Number down to 50 and it would be cool To get like 50 50 sub non-sub ratio just Just for fun other optimizations that Healthy people without gut problems can Make to improve like productivity Performance that kind of thing yeah for Sure so if you got is not quite working Optimally then that can even though you Might not have any specific symptoms it Can still have an impact on your mental Health and your mental performance right So your gut is such an integral part of Your whole body system and ecosystem and Inevitably if it's not happy it's going To be screaming at your brain all the Time and that is noisy and difficult for Your brain to cope with and that can Lead to things like brain fog and Struggling with focus and concentration For example similarly if your gut isn't Happy but you don't really know from Other symptoms but you're getting loads Of bugs infections viruses all the time You notice you're really susceptible That's a good time to start looking at Your gut health and I think I guess for This audience what's really important to Recognize is this connection between Your gut and your brain and how they are Constantly communicating with each other For better or worse so there is a very Strong line of communication between Your gut and your brain which we refer To as the gut brain axis and again they

Are chemically connected through Neurotransmitters that are produced in The gut they are hormonally connected by The HPA axis and they are physically Connected by the vagus nerve and the Chattiest organ between your brain and Your gut is your gut your gut is Constantly telling your brain all sorts Of different things and throwing Messages up that it's got to deal with And people might think oh it's your Brain you've got it's not really doing Anything but actually your brain is busy And it's communicating and it's a lot Through those microbes that live in your Colon Sick You're very good at this thanks it's not My first time you've got the whole like It's like wow Um so what can I do for example as a Proxy for people listening to this My poo is fine once a day you know Medium brown color not overly smelly I Think but everyone like the smell of the Red poo apparently Um but Obviously I want to kind of maximize my Performance and my focus and actually One question we we get so often from our Audience is people struggling to focus And I think often people are like I Struggle to focus on my schoolwork or With my whatever

Web design side hustle I must have ADHD As like an immediate option but I wonder If there's gut stuff we can do before we Get to that point yeah definitely I mean Your gut health is so because your your Gut is constantly communicating with Your brain again if your gut is not Happy things are communicating Differently but also you could just not Be producing enough serotonin for Various different reasons or your gut Might not be sending the right signals Up to your brain so you might have if we Looked at your microbiome and it's Certainly not necessary to do that we Can do this in clinic without testing But if we looked at your microbiome we Might find that you've just not got Enough of these bacteria that are doing This particular important job with brain Connection stuff Um so what we would suggest then is to Really optimize the gut and you know What happens Ali as you know is when People are busy and they're working too Hard and they're doing a side hustle and Everything else is high pressure or They've got a family and everything else People tend to make their diet quite Small and not necessarily in terms of Volume but the types of foods that They're eating so they might end up Eating the same types of foods on repeat What I see is people there's kind of two

Camps here the people who do like the Meal prep stuff and they eat the same Foods five days a week and I think They're being super healthy eating sweet Potato and broccoli every day or you Have the people who are just living meal To meal prep you know Etsy wherever They're going every day the same sorts Of things but just various different Places and nothing's particularly Planned or thought through and Inevitably both of those ways of eating Have an impact on your gut health Whether you feel it in your gut or not So that way of eating limits the types Of fibers that your gut bacteria being Fed and the most important thing for Your gut health is that you're eating 30 Different plants a week so trying to eat Loads of variety of different types of Plants that includes fruit and Vegetables and nuts and whole grains Different types of grains we're super Fixated in this country on like oats and Wheat but actually there's so many Different types of grains that our gut Really benefits from So when you're busy and you're Struggling and you're eating meal to Meal or you're eating the same Foods on Repeat what happens is you've got Health You've got sort of function might not Change but your gut health is inevitably Not optimized and that's when you can

Have these problems with lack of Concentration Focus energy getting bugs All the time that kind of stuff and Really interestingly your gut bacteria Communicate with your hypothalamus so That bit of your brain that controls Things like cortisol production so Really early in your life your gut Bacteria dictate where your sort of HPA Axis is set so how much core style you Release in under given circumstances and We all need some cortisol right but we Don't want loads and loads of cortisol Because we've got loads of anxiety and Stress all the time we can really Struggle to concentrate and to focus so We can use our gut bacteria to try and Reduce that and make things a little bit Better in that department we can use Them and harness their powers to get More serotonin which helps us with Better sleep and concentration and focus And all those important things those Happy hormones and we can also just try And calm down those messages from our Gut to our brain which are distracting Our brain all the time and your gut Bacteria are going to be saying we need More plants and you're going to be not Reading that properly and giving them More Sushi and that's not quite what They want Wow so It sounds like you're saying them please

Correct me if this is an Oversimplification that changing up what You eat can have a massive impact on Your Focus productivity performance Happiness absolutely because all of Those things are linked gut brain Everything yeah fundamentally I mean and Proven in amazing research and science Yeah what kind of research has been done On this I guess I'm I'm thinking healthy People rather than people with official Gut problems yeah so uh the amazing work Of John cryen is a really good place to To start looking at this stuff if people Are interested and he's written an Amazing book called The psychobiotic Revolution so psychobiotics are these Gut bacteria that communicate with our Brain so they're the ones that we're Particularly interested in when we Develop the height smart probiotic for Example so work that's been done in that Area to start with in rodent models they Used a model of an autistic mouse and a Model of a non-autistic mouse or Sociable Mouse and they took the Microbiome so they took a sample and and Gave the microbiome of the autistic Mouse to the sociable Mouse and the Sociable Mouse starts to show autistic Traits okay and when they swap them over The autistic Mouse starts to become a Sociable Mouse just because it's got Microbiomas changed so that was the

Early work that they did trying to Understand how much our gut microbiome Is impacted impacting our mental health Our mental performance how our brain is Working so similar studies to that have Then been replicated in humans in other Places and to be clear that autistic Spectrum Disorder stuff in humans is so Complex and we can't replicate that Exactly in humans as yet but there's Certainly something going on there which Is what we generally learn from rodent Studies we've also got some great data Showing things like increase in Production of Serotonin when we use Particular probiotic species there's Great data showing that using particular Probiotic species within treatment diets And things like that so within treatment Within studies in controlled studies Improves anxiety depression all of these Kinds of symptoms and wider nutrients Within this world if we think about Things like Omega-3s and B vitamins They've been used in place of anxiety And depression medications ssris that Kind of stuff and they work as Effectively in some people some of the Time I'm in study so we can use all of These things and a similar work has been Done with the two straight two of the Strains we use in the smart probiotic in Terms of seeing whether they work as Effectively as common anti-depression

Anti-anxiety medications and they do so Much so that there's Health claims on Them in Canada that people can say these Are definitely shown to improve anxiety And depression So there's great data it's a young field Of research but it's super exciting and It's very solid research just showing That the magic that we can harness from Our gut if someone was being like okay Sophie how do I how do I change my diet Such that it improves my brain function Or makes me have improves my mood what Are like the top recommendations here Yeah great question so Um Omega-3s are super super important For our brain structure as we've talked About and they can also help to protect Us from excess inflammation in the brain Which is linked to anxiety and Depression and stuff like that so either Make sure you're having at least two Portions of oily fish a week or take Care Omega-3 supplements B vitamins are Incredibly important for our brain Health they they produce they make Things like serotonin melatonin all of Our they make dopamine Gaba all of these Really important brain chemicals that we Really need all the time so B vitamins Are really essential for brain function And we've got some really interesting Work showing that you can use B vitamins In controlled circumstances in

Replacement of ssris so anxiety and Depression treatments and they will work In a very similar way in the right doses At the right moment for the right people So be vitamin is super super important For General brain function and brain Health and then we also think about Things like antioxidants and Particularly the anthocyanins from Blueberries are amazing for our brain Health so not just blueberries but Anthocyanins come in like red cabbage Other dark purple vegetables and there's Some amazing data showing that if Children are given a blueberry smoothie Before an exam they perform better in That exam than the children who haven't Had a blueberry smoothie and then when We swap them over and the level of the Exam stays the same and the first Children are given the blueberry Smoothie not going to be with me second Or an R the children who had the Blueberry smoothie always perform better Than the children who didn't have the Booboo smoothie so what we think is Happening there is it's getting better Blood to your brain and that is meaning That you can have a better mental Performance in a very like short like Period of time so it's having that Direct impact on your brain health in That moment that thing that you just Said I imagine there are some people

Listening to this thinking oh my God that sounds incredible and just as Many probably thinking oh my God That sounds like the worst thing in the World this guy's a psychopath like Um I wonder like I mean most people do The same thing but with music Right so let's take Hamilton for example Um I eat biographies for breakfast I'm Obsessed right like I literally wrote a Rap album about the life of Arnold Schwarzenegger after I listened to Hamilton for the first time Um Hamilton the musical it's about two Hours 40 minutes long it is the best Biography of Hamilton in my opinion Right it's dramaticized but like you Can't take away from the beat and lyrics And everything else when you listen to Music it's exactly like listening to a Book especially if you pay attention to The lyrics by the way one really cool Thing is if you start listening to a lot Of audiobooks you will notice and Remember all the lyrics from all the Songs you listen to most people who I am Friends with Um you know they listen to the beat or The melody and they don't necessarily Recall or understand the lyrics they Need to look at the lyrics on their Phone to really and take them for me Like both happen because I've trained That part of my brain

But if you already do this for music why Do you do it with music because it Enriches your life It Makes You Happy Well Brandon sanderson's uh you know the Way of Kings enriches my life I'm sorry Even more than music and so again it Doesn't matter if it's fantasy or Fiction or philosophy or sci-fi I listen Because it makes me happy it's it's Beautiful it's enjoyable I'm living Inside this world and the joy that you Get from a book if you've read a book Is so much deeper than the Joe you get From watching a movie or watching a TV Series and so I don't watch TV I don't Watch movies I just consume books but I Do it with my ears Do you like uh presumably on on the few Occasions where you do watch TV movies YouTube videos do you speed those up as Well or do you sort of slow it down and Watch it as the Director pre intended or Some like that I cannot deal with The speed of movies and TV shows at this Point so I use an app on my on my Computer called uh Video speed controller uh you can Increment the speed by 0.1 increments And when like my friends don't notice I I up it by 20 but if I was watching by Myself I'd watch to do by 5x speed YouTube on my computer automatically Plays a 3X speed for everything Um and again okay we talked about you

Know working out right before this when I was younger You know lifting 145 pounds was Difficult now I can then press that however long you Want me to Um and so you build the muscle right if You build the muscle and you can bench Press like 225 easy Um there's no reason to set the Resistance to 145 set it to 25. and so The trick is just practice listening Faster and here's the key Some of us are able to read at a Thousand words per minute like there are People who can do this right a college Professor in the United States typically Will read about a 330 350 words per Minute no one goes how dare you read That quickly It's the same thing it's just that the Upper level that is accessible to most People and listening is a lot easier to Reach and here's why We've been listening for hundreds of Thousands of years We've only been reading For like a thousand years We evolved to be really good at Storytelling and paying attention and Processing with our ears It's a hack you know the idea of writing Characters and then decoding them it's An amazing hack but it's a hack

Um it's not what humans evolved to learn How to do If you learn and here's the thing right Reading is a highly computational Behavior for the brain to do typically About 97 of your brain function is Actually working on decoding and only Three percent can focus on comprehension But if you listen like three percent is Focusing on decoding 97 focus on Comprehension so computers Are designed for computing the really Good at Computing and so if you could Outsource the computational work Of reading to a computer that's the best Except AI was not good enough to read Like a human until Just about now Um and so now you can do that just think About it this way right how many of us Do long division math in our head nobody You pull up your iPhone you do it on Your phone It makes sense to do the same thing with Reading Um do you listen to podcasts very much I didn't used to and the quality of Podcasts significantly increased over The last 10 months so now I do my Favorite is how to take over the world By Ben Wilson Oh my God it's amazing Okay so I came up I came across this Podcast

The first episode I listened to was uh The life of Julius Caesar uh and then I Listened to Napoleon's biography by him And then he recently put out the Biography of Um Brigham Young And what he'll do is he'll read like Five primary sources and he'll produce Like a two to three hour uh biography Podcast he's got a great voice and then He'll also find the overarching concepts From all their lives for example they All eat fast they all attack fast They're all really good at communication And it's fascinating and so you know I Love the idea of taking over the world Not in the same violent way that people Used to but there's a lot that you can Learn so I'm obsessed with Hamilton I'm Also obsessed with Napoleon Um and you know Sandy for Julius Caesar And so the more you study people the More interesting it is and so that the Reason why I didn't like podcasts Historically is you know you got one Person interviewing another person Another person editing basically three Human hours run into one minute of you Consuming but if I fly from like California to New York and I listen to The Book Obama row before he became President that book is eight hours long I listen to 2x speed 3x speed by the

Time I land I finish that book it's like I sat next to Obama the entire time but He spent an hour thinking about every Single minute of what he was going to Say And so books used to be a more dense Source of information uh podcasts Recently have improved dramatically the Other thing that happened to me is that Now read enough books that it's actually Difficult for me to find new things in Books but the lead time from something Being discovered To appearing in a podcast is faster than The lead time for something being Discovered to be published in a book and So when I was in college uh I knew I was In the right classes when I started not Being able to Wikipedia the concepts About photovolsthetics engineering they Were learning in class and I could only Learn that from the professors directly And so what I did is I took all these Classes and I would email professors at Stanford and MIT and Harvard to like ask Them additional questions Um it's now become the case that for Most topics you can learn more Cutting Edge stuff from podcasts so that's Really cool hmm Yeah Interesting that's a good way of Thinking about it um the way I think About audiobooks versus podcasts is

Audiobooks are really good if I want to Get like a just a broad General like Sort of Blitz about about a particular Topic but one thing I like about Podcasts is that usually like for Example if Tim if Tim Ferriss is an Interviewing Morgan house all about the Psychology of money like the book is Good but in a way him asking questions To the thing will spark other things in My mind of like even though I've read The book I still find the interview Valuable or I can't one when Cal Newport Is interviewing Tim Ferris about Something I'm very familiar with both of Their work and so the way they talk About it as a meta level of awareness to The topic but there's no point me Listening to a podcast about nuclear Because I know nothing about the topic And so to get the foundational Groundwork the books are sick and then At that point I can understand what the Experts are talking about And then the other thing I would say is Amazing about books is if you listen to Fantasy or sci-fi World building it's Really difficult to build a world and Have it be Um Congruent and consistent and actually There's a lot of strategy in doing that And so you get a lot of emotional Rewards uh by listening to a fantasy or

Sci-fi audiobook that someone has spent A lot of time thinking about I'd love to talk a little bit about the New book uh the love prescription seven Days to more intimacy connection and joy I've started reading that on my Kindle And I've got the physical copy arriving In the next in the next couple of days Um but it's interesting because one of The one of the claims in the book or at Least in the in the blurb is that there Is a formula for a good relationship and If you just I almost the vibe that I got Was that hey if you follow the formula And just do these seven things across These seven days or however however long It takes you will just almost magically Improve the quality of your relationship Uh so I wonder if you can just kind of Riff on that a little bit like what is This formula for love Yeah Sure so one of the things is being nice To one another So you know uh giving apart a Compliments uh you know uh catching your Partner doing something right and and Communicating that communicating respect And affection and words letting your Partner know how attractive they are to You and how irresistible they seem at Times you know those that kind of Positivity is very very critical another One is

Turning toward it turns out to be a very Powerful thing in a relationship so you Know in our apartment lab what we saw 130 newlywed couples and followed them For six years We discovered that a lot of time when They're just kind of hanging out in this Apartment lab one person will try to get The other person's attention or share Something humorous or you know some Interesting story that they've heard or Are reading about and then they try to Connect they make a bid for connection And then the cameras in the lab always Swung to the other person to see the Response and there were one of three Responses turning toward which was you Know really acknowledging the connection You know one person might say Oh What a Beautiful boat that is you know going by And if the other person said yeah huh uh That was turning toward if they didn't Respond at all that was turning away or If they responded irritably would you be Quiet I'm trying to read that was Turning against So when we followed couples the the 17 Couples who divorced one another after Uh six years after the wedding uh when We looked back six years earlier they Had turned toward these bids only 33 of The time Whereas the couples who are still Together

Six years earlier had turned toward the Bids 86 percent of the time You know a huge difference And we also discovered that turning Toward is like an emotional bank account That you build when you really connect With your partner when your partner Wants to connect with you then During conflict You have more of a sense of humor about Yourself and about one another you can Laugh together and you can be Affectionate even when you disagreeing And it reduces physiological arousal so Turning toward is another one that's Very very powerful and when people Become aware of that as a tool of Connecting then the relationship Improves quite dramatically right so in This book what we're doing is each day We're giving couples little thing to do Little 10 minute thing to do every Single day like one day we'll be giving Compliments you know really expressing Fondness and admiration a second day Will be look for what your partner is Doing right And not just wrong right and point it Out and say thank you to your partner You know third is listening you know Talking about your needs with one Another what do you need and we Emphasize you should bring up your needs As a positive need rather than a

Negative need and what that means is That you ask for what you do want Not what you don't like or you present Don't bring that up because that's going To sound like criticism instead flip it On its head and say I would love it if You clean the dishes three times a week That would be such a big help to me That's a positive mean so uh people Present you know on I forget which day They talk about one need they have with Their partner that can allow their Partner to shine for them it's not a Criticism it's the opposite Right another one is honoring each Other's dreams so talk about what maybe Deeply hell dream you have for something You want to do something you want to Experience something you want to feel Whatever it is Share that with your partner and really Listen to what your partner says about That question too So you know there what we hope to see if People practice this every day for seven Days is that from before they started it To the end of the week they'll see a Little bit of change maybe little Something feels different and they can Talk about which one of those little Prescriptions really made a difference For them Now it doesn't mean everything gets Fixed in seven days and then you can go

Back to being whoever you were before no It's instead that you're learning how to Do something a little different that Deepens the Friendship deepens emotional Intimacy which of course opens up to you Know what you know more sexual intimacy And helps you when you have to talk About conflict continue those practices Especially the ones you found the best For you and your partner And you'll see over time you know the Relationship is doing this over time big Change all right we're just going to Take a quick break from the podcast to Introduce our sponsor which is very Excitingly heal I have been a paying Customer of huel since 2017 so it's been About six years now that I've been using Q fairly regularly I started eating Hill In my fifth year of medical school and I've been using heal regularly ever Since because you know I like to be Productive I've you know my calendar is Full with a lot of things and often I Don't have the time or don't make the Time to have a particularly healthy Breakfast or a particularly healthy Lunch my favorite flavor is salted Caramel because for 400 calories you get 40 grams of protein which is absolutely Insane and you also get a decent healthy Mix of carbohydrates and fiber and fat Along with 26 different vitamins and Minerals which are all very good for the

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For a break and and say when they ask For a break when they'll come back to Talk about the conversation you know That topic again so they'll say Something like honey I I've got to take A break I'll be back in an hour then Let's talk again That way they don't leave the other Person feeling abandoned and not knowing If you're ever going to talk about it Again then when the partners separate Into separate quarters uh they each do Something that is self-soothing Not think about the fight because if They think about it they'll stay Escalated but do something else distract Yourself read a magazine a book listen To music meditation go for a run you Know all kinds of things you can do to Self-soothe take a bath and then come Back at the designated time when you're Calmer and a way to tell if your calmer Is take your heart rate and if your Heart rate is back down to normal then You're good if it's not back go back to Your partner anyway and ask for more Time Give a second time you'll return until You can talk calmly with one another and The conversation will look like you've Just had a brain transplant your latest Book some days today which is sick is I Guess on the surface a productivity book And there are some people that like oh

Productivity is for losers productivity Is all about just like grinding yourself To the ground and not having any fun uh But you don't strike me as that kind of Guy so what I guess what's your broad Approach to these goals and to Productivity in general I like to think that productivity is Really dream oriented that Everyone should have a dream and if they Don't they probably do and they're not Admitting to it or they do that terrible Thing where they don't actually spend Time thinking about themselves one of The tragedies of the world is we spend All of our time thinking about our Parents and our spouses and our children And our business and our clients and our Customers but it's very rare that Someone sits down and just says I'm Going to think about me for a little While how I got here you know where am I Going what are my goals as a Storyteller I'm obsessed with finding stories so I Have something new to say on stage so Storytellers tend to be deeply curious About themselves we're self-centered in What I say is a positive way just Meaning we afford ourselves times to Think about us so in terms of Productivity you first have to have the Dream or a multitude of dreams you have To have a horizon that's when I like to Think of it as what's your horizon

What's the point on the horizon but that Point on the horizon can be I've always Wanted to have a backyard vegetable Garden you know or I was talking to a Client the other day and I said well What's your horizon goal and she said I Want to see the 50 great movies of all Time there's a list in the world I'd Have the list and I want to sit on my Couch and watch the 50 greatest movies She said but that doesn't feel super Productive and I said that sounds Incredibly productive to me because it's Your dream so when people say Productivity sort of grinds you down I Think of productivity as it's the thing That you want to be doing that you Should be doing more of so let's Maximize our life the things we have to Do in order to sustain life in order to Get to the things we want to do so we Don't have to think of productivity in Terms of work we can if you're one of Those people who have enormous work Dreams and and money dreams and how Streams and vacation dreams that's great Like those are all valuable goals if That means something to you but if your Goal is to sit on the couch more and Watch black and white movies with your Husband and make sure you see all of Them before you die all the ones you're Supposed to see that's a wonderful goal Let's make sure we maximize your work

Time you are for chore time let's take Away all of those little black holes of Your life that you're wasting and make Sure that we use all that so you can get Your ass on the couch more often with Your husband watching black and white Movies I think that's the way to dispel That productivity nonsense which is we Have to grind ourselves it's just dream Oriented choose the right dream And then productivity will make total Sense to you that's nice I like that Terminology like all right what's your Horizon goal um and I guess We can have Horizon goals for different Areas of our life like if I imagine for Like my book The Horizon goal is oh Actually brought more more broadly I'd Like to be an author who writes books Every few years because it seems kind of Fun Um and then I guess I can break that Down into more concrete steps like is That how you approach it you figure out The Horizon goal and you break it down Like what's what's your process for this Yeah well I like a horizon goal because I think that You know if we're thinking about a dream Or that thing on the horizon I think When people Define it very specifically It's a mistake you know I originally Thought I was going to be a Storyteller Who told stories on stages in New York

And Boston and maybe somewhere else in The world and if I had made that Horizon Point sort of defined and specific I Would have only moved in that direction I like thinking of Horizons because That it's sort of very wide it's a Distant point that you can't quite see It's the acknowledgment that the road You're on the path you're taking might Not actually land you and the place you Thought you would land but you'll land In the vicinity it's an it's an Approximation of the dream you know even With sort of a book I start writing a Novel it always starts with a what if Question and I think I know what the end Is going to be it never has been the end I allow the book to sort of dictate Where the where the final moment of this Character is going to be and I just see It as a horizon but sometimes I go wow That was quite left of whatever I Thought it was going to land but it's in The vicinity it's not behind me it's Always somewhere in the front so I like To identify that idea of I'm going to be A Storyteller but that I'm going to be a Storyteller also allows because it's on The horizon to be maybe I'll teach Storytelling someday maybe I'll be a Consultant about storytelling maybe Maybe an advertising company will allow Me to inject storytelling into their car Commercial which is what I've done right

All of those things are sort of on the Storytelling Horizon but it affords me The opportunity to be flexible in terms Of what ultimately is going to happen Okay so let's say I have which I sort of Do a horizon goal of I'd like to be a Musical performer of some kind Um I did this was actually when I you Know back in like 2008 when I discovered YouTube uh the channels I was mostly Following were the YouTube music cover Artists and I'd watch them play the Piano or the guitar and sing along to Some cover of a popular song and think Damn that's sick I really want to do Something like that and I had a few full Stars I dabbled with a few videos here And there over the years and it was only Like 10 years later that I was like you Know what let me sit down and teach what I know about how to get into med school That I actually became a YouTuber so it Sort of ended up going in a completely Different direction but I have always Had in the back of my mind that At some point someday Um I would like to Um oh yeah I'd like to explore that Interest a little bit more I love the Idea of learning how to play instruments Myself and learning music theory and Learning how to compose and arrange and Then singing either myself or with Friends to two popular songs so that's

Like a vague Horizon goal I guess like I Like that yeah yeah that makes sense to Me yeah yeah so I think next in terms of Breaking it down or like yeah what's the Process well it sounds to me like you're Not quite sure like what You know path that's you're going to Take to the Horizon and I and I like That too you know I think the mistake People would make would be I am going to Get a record contract I am going to be a Lead singer in a rock band with a record Contract that is a bad idea I think what You've said is I want to do something in Music and I kind of want to be a person Maybe making music and making people Happy with that music right but if that Horizon means you know what I discovered I'm actually a really good DJ I don't Need to learn how to play a music Because I can actually scratch and that Actually fills that need for me or it Could be turns out I can't play Instruments but what I can do is I can Find people who play them really well And I can help them make better music And become a music producer right that's That's in that general area and I think It's when people say no I will not be Happy unless I have a record contract And I'm in a rock band and I'm Performing in arenas that's the only Thing that's going to make me happy I think that's a terrible sort of

Approach to life so I like your approach Which is I kind of want to do something In music I think I want to play music But you know open to other things and Then I would just do what you're doing Which is begin the exploration start Walking down the path you know all right Let me try a guitar for a while right my Wife wanted to play the guitar and then She quickly realized you know what the Ukulele is better than the guitar it's Easier to play it's smaller and I can Use it in my kindergarten classroom so She became a ukulele player she's pretty Good and then one day I said are you Ever gonna sing with the ukulele and she Said I don't know I'm not that good of a Singer but it turns out with the ukulele It doesn't demand you to be a good Singer because the instrument is so sort Of Small and light and amusing that you Don't have to sort of sing really Beautifully you can just sing well so She has become a ukulele player who Plays music to her kindergarten students And changes the way they learn because Of it not her original goal which is I Want to play the guitar someday but it's Become this thing and all she did was She started on the path she took Positive steps forward most people spend An enormous amount of time thinking About what they should do to get to the

Horizon rather than saying well this is One possible step I could take I'm going To take the one possible step and if It's not the right one I will take Another possible step but I cannot tell You how many people I meet who say well I'm still trying to plot out my thing And I always say all the thinking you're Doing about reaching your goal is Meaningless and useless and it doesn't Count for anything if you're just Thinking about getting there you're Doing nothing take a step forward even If that means going online and buying a Ukulele that's the first step grade you Made a positive step today a ukulele is Coming to your home think about what the Next thing you can do is you know the Idea of incrementalism is so important People don't believe in it the idea that Tiny changes accumulated over time Produce enormous results most people Want a Big Gulp a magic pill they want To instantly have a million subscribers They want to have a perfect YouTube Video they want to have a book contract Before they actually write the book or Even before they even write the proposal Right everyone sort of wants this Enormous leap and if you examine the Success stories which I always believe You should do is like just examine the Success stories of people in the world So that you can get a sense of what

Those success stories are all of them Involve tiny incremental changes piling Up over time that eventually produce Enormous results but people don't Believe in it because they can't see it Immediately you know I just recently Started I learned that people who have Better balance live longer because if You get older and you don't have good Balance you fall all and those Falls put You in the hospital and old people in The hospital die you you know that it Probably better than I do and so one of The tricks I Learned was when you're Brushing your teeth stand on one foot During the first minute of brushing your Teeth and see if you can maintain that One foot and then switch to the other One and so I've started doing that and I've asked people or I've told people This is a really good idea you know to Help you improve your balance and Someone came back to me and said after a Month well I don't really see my balance Improving And I said well first of all you didn't Really gauge your balance you didn't Assess your balance on day one to day 30. so it's impossible for you to even Say that but I said this is incremental Change you're not even supposed to see It you're not even supposed to expect to See it you just have to believe that Every single day that you spend a minute

On each foot twice a day if you're Brushing your teeth twice a day which You should be Over time the piling up of small things Will produce enormous results but you Can't expect to see the results Immediately and if you do That's when people fail to sort of make Changes in their life that are Meaningful okay Um so we've got 70 people in the team so Far at the moment Let's say uh as a bit of a thought Experiment You were allowed to clone like three of Them oh a million times over and you're Like like if you think of the people That I like I would clone you in a Heartbeat add to my business what are The what are the characteristics of Those like clonable top performers oh Um And I guess I'm asking for someone Listening to this is like you know if They're in a job and they want to kind Of stand out or join a new job or Anything like that like what are the Things that someone like you would be Looking for as a business owner tenacity Tenacity is at the word where you push Through I think there's not enough People in businesses that just keep Pushing like even if you get a pushback No you can't do that or you know it's

Going to take time yeah no we'll figure Out another way and I think those are The people in my business that I go yes I'm so glad I've got you because I think People who don't take no for an answer Or don't take pushbacks for an answer Are the ones that succeed 100 so I think Tenacity Um the second thing that I would do is Clone anybody that is super curious so One of the things I do I test people in Job interviews and I go have you got any Questions and if they go no I don't Think I have They don't get the job Anybody that wants to be successful or Is you know going to be good at their Job are curious they're going to have a Million questions and I want a million Questions I want them to ask me Carrie What do you do day to day or how much Money do you make or you know um what Are the problems in the business or What's the first thing you would like me To do or whatever it is people who ask Questions they're the ones that succeed The most and they're the ones that do Well in things like pitches if they're Asking their clients questions all the Time tell me about this tell me about That how do I know about this like like How do I learn as much as possible about You and your company they're the ones That succeed so I think those are the

Two things that I mainly focus on is Tenacity and curiosity Um and then lastly I think it's just Enthusiasm I think people that are just Every day positive about their job and I Think obviously we're not all positive You know when I go through days of Negativity I don't want to really go to Work today whatever it is but I think if You have a positive outlook mostly on Life I think you can change the Perception of most people most things Basically can you think of many people That you have that have those category Those characteristics but you would Still say are underperforming like is There a because we've we've talked about Kind of like personality traits tenacity Curiosity and enthusiasm yeah is there Like a kind of tangible performance Element as well that's Decor related From those things or do you find that it Kind of tends to go together Tends to go together I think there's a Couple of things that I noticed Repeatedly in those people that they Need to improve on usually those people Aren't very good at Um Delegating work they're like protective Over I can do this I can do that you Know they they force through things and I guess they're not very good at Delegating work down and working as a

Team and things like that but overall They're usually the high performers I Call them the a players everyone has Like businesses have a plays and B Players and I've not list who they are Today or anything like that I have many A players and one of the things that I Always say is if you a good business is Based off how many a players they're Having a business so if you have 30 People in your company and Um 15 of them are a players you've got a Very good company I think people usually have what two 3A Players Um and it's really hard to get them by The way Um but yeah I I try to aim as many as Possible And can you tell in an interview that Someone's going to be an a player or is It like within a couple of months of Seeing them like when when do you find Out usually I can tell in an interview And it's usually those three traits I Just mentioned and I usually ask them When was the last time you pushed Through something to that show tenacity Like you didn't take note you didn't Give up Um have you got any questions curiosity Um and then enthusiasm I just asked them Tell me something that you've done Recently and just see how enthusiastic

They tell and you go you just know that They are going to be your a players and Do you find that that prediction holds True when when you see them In real life yes it does the only thing Is a players don't usually stick around Because they become entrepreneurs they Usually go and start their own Businesses and that's what happened with Me I had a lot of people leave and go Start businesses which I'm very proud of I'm like wow like I hired 100 overall I've had 140 people in last three years And so many of them have gone to start Their own businesses and I'm proud of That because I remember thinking like I Want my people to work here and go and Work for Netflix or Disney or you know Amazing brands or go start their own Businesses and I'll be very very proud And that's my success metric if I can go And create that so yeah the fat people Have gone and started their own Businesses is a good thing but it did Mean that I had to constantly replace People because they they come they learn And then they move on and go start their Own thing and so yeah a play is a very Very valuable but they're very hard to Keep what's the balance between I guess being yourself Versus choosing yourself In the sense of for me my my default Self you know we talked about how the

Self is you know um a result of Accidents of stuff my default behavior Is often to prioritize work at the Expense of everything else I am the Happiest person in the world if I've Spent five hours in the evening on my Laptop from 6 pm to 11 p.m Um but that's not really the person I Want to be I want to be a person who has More balance who takes care of their Health and their relationships and who Views time spent with loved ones loved Ones not as a You know I want to I'd rather be on my Laptop but more like a I'm genuinely Happy to be here in the present moment Even so that's that's kind of who I want To be but it's not who I am if that if That makes sense so how do we How do I know which one is more quote Authentic because I find that my mum Often says sometimes that oh you know Ali you know you're you're trying to Change for other people and stuff this Was when at University I made the active Decision that I wanted to become more Confident and charismatic and be more of More outgoing whereas in school I was a Massive nerd and played World of Warcraft all evening yeah and so to my Mum that was the the real me and she Would say that you're fine as you are You don't need to change I'd be like no But I want to change like I wanna I

Wanna level up that's just better I Think to be more confident I'm going uh Yeah what do you reckon There is the Conditioned self And there is true self There is The mind and identity And there is Spirit What we've come to identify of who we Are is actually the construction of the Mind The mind has created an identity we Enter this world and then the mind is Trying to understand Who am I What does that mean who are you what is This world how do they all fit together And it creates an identity and it builds One And it builds certain understandings of The world and what people do and Intentions And it's mapping out this internal world And that is down to the accidents of Birth that is down to like you're saying You know your family your cultural Experiences the place and time in this Universe that we have this opportunity The mind will always do that then there Is true self which is just consciousness And the nature of Consciousness is love Is truth

The mind says I need to get everything In place and then I'll feel at peace the Soul says be at peace and everything Else falls into place We've been living from our minds for the Majority of Our Lives though We've been living from that place and We've built up Armory and we've built up Coping mechanisms to navigate The path is beginning to Take off some of the armory To see that actually when I connect to Truth and love I will Then see what it looks like you don't Need to figure that out If you can just go down into that place Of Truth and Love You will see What it will look like Because one thing we do know is that the Mind is a terrible predictor of what Will make us happy All these ideas My life has to look like this it should Look like this and then I'll be happy We've got no idea We've got no idea we don't even know What's going to happen in one minute of Time So to take away all the configuration For the mind trying to Even choose or a map or or build or be a Lot of Self-improvement is talking about

Improving who you are or optimizing who You are which is based on the premise That you are not enough You're you're not good enough you're not Whole enough you're not You're not enough so you've got to do More a change to be better or get being Caught in the same trap Move away from mine down into Consciousness into that field of Consciousness tap into that place of Love and into it intuition and move from That place of Truth and then we'll see What it looks like So what does that look like in my Confidence I want to be confident Because I feel like I'm not yet Confident and I would like to be more That way yes yeah This idea that you're not confident is An idea Take away the illusion And then we'll find truth So it's The more that we begin to Drop out of the Mind the more that we Create separation from the mind we'll Just begin to notice oh gosh my mind is Just saying that I'm not confident gosh My mind has created an identity of of Who I am it's got its idea of who Ali is And we can be curious about that and see It from a distance as if you're Observing another person so what is

Identity that my mind has created about Ali Who does my mind say that Ali is what Does my mind say Ali can do in kanji Gosh what does my mind judge that would Be inappropriate for Ali to do We just begin to see it we begin to see How the mind created all these Preconceived ideas and Notions oh gosh It says that he's not confident The moment that we create separation From it and we fear and distance from it We will then just be moving from truth And the truth is You are neither confident nor not Confident You just are You are neither Brilliant nor not brilliant you just are The mystics would just say I am That's all we can say I am and there is No there's no label that we can attach To something which can capture reality Okay There's No Label which can accurately Capture Ultimate power and love there's no name For it it's just pure power you are pure Power you're pure even that's just a Name or an idea but you're just pure Power and and energy And we'll see where that energy can go But when we move from that place even The idea of confident and confident

Doesn't make sense anymore It's like what You know color is the number seven And that doesn't make sense that's not Who I am that's not that's not what I am It's just then more ramblings of the Mind You move from that place of power And you will all that will happen is it Will be unfoldings and you'll just begin To If we turn to confidence then into Something more concrete like Ability to play fingerstyle on the Guitar An ability to play finger finger Style On the guitar you know that kind of that Kind of music So that's an ability yeah so you can Accurately assess yeah what if my level Of ability in terms of playing the Guitar Yep and I can choose to actively improve That ability or increase that ability if I want to yes Similarly if I like confident is a bit Dodge but if I were to think instead of Being confident which is like a almost Like a character trait that is has a Value judgment on it because more Confident is generally better uh yes Society judges but instead of it Thinking at thinking a specific skill of Public speaking while doing

Presentations specific ability to go up To a pretty girl and talk to her Specific ability to Whatever completely those are then areas In which I can decide okay I actually Want to work on my presentation skills Therefore I'm going to watch some YouTube videos and do some practice yes But I'm not Using that as a way of thinking Therefore I am currently unconfident Because in a way that also becomes a Self-fulfilling prophecy Completely so we can build up individual Skills And say the the key part though is just Seeing when the mind is making judgments And being able to see that as Just the nature of your mind which is a Tool Because whenever you live from a place Of No mind or just live from a place of Presence You're not even thinking about Confidence or not confident so if I Think about me right now How am I coming across as confident or Not confident I'd have to make a Judgment I don't know Like potentially some people might say Yes or no it doesn't matter I just need To be me all right we're just going to Take a quick break from this episode to

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Reverse engineer the career from that Rather than hey I did an economics Degree therefore private Equity hedge Funds or Investment Banking are my three Options and you end up going down one of These one of these routes Um and that that post really vibed with Me because I think it helped it made me Think Hmm if I were to begin with a Lifestyle in mind does that in fact Actually look like the big Media Company Um the answer is probably not but then Another part of me was like am I just Feeling Uh Am I just bullshitting myself and just Like setting my ambitions lower because I am afraid of the work that it would Take to build said Media company and try And try and go big and I'm just content To wallow in my own mediocrity of like Oh I'll just write four hours a day and Then I'm happy with life I don't need to Make that much money and you do you get What I'm getting up yeah I don't think You're dilute so first of all I love That post so yeah Lifestyle Center Career planning I think is such a Critical idea Um especially for young people trying to Figure out like in college I wrote that While at a graduation ceremony for my Sister so I was thinking about graduate Graduation advice yeah and you and it it

Has to be the right answer for how you Figure out your career which is you get The image of the lifestyle you want at Whatever point you know in the future And you make it super tangible like you Can you can feel it you can smell it you Can see it but not getting specific at All about what your work is like are you In the countryside are you in a city is It you know you're you're at the Bohemian bar in the in the Lower East Side and and around all these artists Are you in a field and you've been out In the sun and like you know whatever Working on your Trails like what is it Is it very social are you in a small Town are you what are you up in the Mountains like get that really clear and Then say great let me work backwards now To figure out how do I get there with my Work Right and and I think that's such a Critical way of thinking about things Because hey it's not just hey Follow Your Passion or something like this Because the right answer might be I'm Going to go to medical school so that I Can be uh sort of get these Nightingale Shifts where I work uh three times a Week one week out of the month or Something like that or work for three Months and it's and it's the highest Hourly rate I can get and then I can Spend the whole summer in the Canary

Islands like it it can lead you to Really interesting places I think it's The way to do it and the reason why I Think you in particular are not you're Not deluding yourself into you know Avoiding the difficulties of ambition is That a lot of people when they do this Exercise it is a hundred percent clear They want that they really crave that Activity and work right so I think it's A really clear personality type thing That that if you are the type of person Whose ideal lifestyle does involve I've Got a team I'm making moves it's super Really clear if you talk to those people And I have because you know this is my Framework and I run that framework past There's a lot of people who are like I Love the idea of activity I don't want To be doing something I want people you Know I want to be at the center of Attention I want people that are on my Team I want to be I love that action the Sociality the the some people love that So If you don't feel it unambiguous a Course that's what I want to do Then I think that's really meaningful And I'll tell you I think I'm like you Which is why the way I am logistically Handling the business aspect of all this Career is right now I have a half day Rule One half day a week it has to fit in

That if it can't if something can't fit In that then I can't do it and my goal Down the line is make that one day a Week what is slow productivity Probably so yeah so if we don't have Here's the issue with knowledge work in General The issue we've been grappling with in The last 20 minutes like what does Productivity even mean right and and so Then it just becomes this weird Catch-all or Boogeyman so I have this Thought of like why don't we actually Positively come out and come up with a Definition that we'd like a definition That's human a definition that that Melds well with our human instincts and The way our brain is actually wired That's centered around producing Meaningful and valuable things but in a Way that's very sustainable in a way That's very satisfying so so instead of Just pushing Back Against The Boogeyman Productivity like let's put in place an Alternative and the alternative I've Been working on is called slow Productivity and like the slow food Movement or these other movements I've I've gone back and pulled from these Sort of existing cultures of knowledge Workers that have been around for Centuries in some cases Millennia that Had the privilege and space to kind of Figure out what's the best way to work

With your mind you know what works what Doesn't and figuring out can we have a Widely applicable definition of Productivity comes out of it and so slow Productivity has three principles to it Do fewer things yeah Working at a natural pace Obsessing over quality Like those three things approaching Knowledge work with those three Principles Realigns the efforts with uh our Humanity the way we're wired I can give You a a neuroscience argument for it I Can give you a psychological argument For it I can give you a philosophical Argument for those three things all on All three of those levels Orienting knowledge work around that is Meaningful satisfying you can produce Things a great value it can be very Productive for companies that can be Very satisfying for individuals so I'm Sort of putting together my pitch of What what Target a productivity should People who make a living using their Brains what it what should they be going For Beyond just you know Get after it have your to-do's organized I don't know what's what's the Philosophical argument Well there's uh like we go back to Aristotle if we need to right there's This the what what is the the teleology

Of of human existence well what's the One thing we have that other creatures Don't is we have these brains that can Sit and think and create things Um and there's there's a there's a There's an argument towards the the the Production of things of value and Meaning and sort of giving things the Time they require craftsmanship that There's a real philosophical Foundation To the human value that's extracted from Actually like doing things of of value Of impact with your mind and a lot of That gets sapped away when you're just Answering emails all day uh or just Hustling to get after it you could go All the way back to neuro I mean this is The the thing I'm working on now is I I've gone back heavily to do a deep into The mainly social anthropological Research to do a deep history of work For 300 000 years what was work for Humans because that's a long enough time Span that our brain Evolved right the the match this Definition of work and you know surprise Surprise when you go back and look Through this deep literature you see Not doing too many things Sees a variation in Pace and intensity a Lot of your time being the application Of hard one skills like that's exactly What comes up that's what we did for 300 000 years so there's also this almost

Like psychology anthropological even Neuroscientific argument for not being Overloaded varying your intensity in Various ways and spending more of your Time like applying hard-wone skills like What we expect work to be Do you have you stumbled across any kind Of Um Dunbar number for number of active Projects that one should have at a given Time like when you say fewer things yeah I mean how few are we talking Well yeah I mean I so there there's two Different time scales I mean at the Scale of like what you're working on Right now it's one right so like in the What what we cannot do what our brain Cannot do is concurrently during like The afternoon go back and forth between Three different things It's just the way our planning Motivation Loop works like we have one Thing in our working memory we build This internal model that pulls episodic Memories out of the hippocampus we use That to try to predict what we should do Next that system cannot handle more than One thing so we cannot be thinking about Making decisions on or making progress On more than one thing at a time and I Don't mean like literally at the time Like Over a couple hours even like work on One thing till you're done move on to

The other thing our brain cannot go back And forth It's why email like going back And forth between your email just Crushes us psychologically uh you know a Recent podcast episode I talked about Task freeze where you see like 15 things You need to do and you just stop it's Because you literally the planning Motivational Center of your brain can't Make plans for 15 things at the same Time it neurologically can't do that so Your motivation system just freezes up Right so at a time one thing in terms of Like ongoing projects I'm a big believer In like pull-based methodology where There's like two or three things you're Two or three things you're working on When something finishes you can pull Something else in You know and I actually think this is How companies should organize work Software developers already do this but I think we should do this more broadly In knowledge work where yeah there's a Lot of work the company needs to do Don't just distribute that to everyone's Plate and everyone has 20 things that They have to kind of figure out what to Do with they should just be working on a Couple things and they can pull in new Things once they're once it's ready and The problem why you need well I think This is important and why I think it's Killer to have a lot of things on your

Plate even if you're not working on them At the exact same time is there's Something called an overhead tax that Every project that you have committed to Generates it's a overhead of Administrative work that you have to do Even if you're not actively working on The project it's emails you have to send Meetings planning meetings standing Meetings you have to have and just Cognitive load of knowing it's there so That builds up so if you have 15 Projects on your plate you're paying Overhead tax on 15 projects and that tax Takes up your time and before you know It most of your time mental energy is Going to the maintenance of the ongoing Project and almost nothing gets done and Then you fall farther behind and then The the more projects build up and the Tax gets worse I call it the overhead Spiral it's a terrible state to be in so There's a real cost to having too many Things on your plate even if you're very Careful about this morning I'm just Working on this and then in the Afternoon I'm just working on that and On Tuesdays I work on this once you get Past a certain level it's a problem and I think again it's something companies Get wrong they just say let's distribute The task informally to everyone we'll Have everything live on people's Individual plates and they can just

Figure out what to work on and whatnot And the overhead text kills them like a Much better system is this all sits in a Holding tank And when I'm ready for the next thing I Pull it in but until it leaves that Holding tank I'm paying no overhead tax On it it's not actually it's not Actually my view so I honestly think Like three active projects at a time is Best and obviously when you're working On something you're only working on that One thing all right so that's it for This week's episode of Deep dive thank You so much for watching or listening All the links and resources that we Mentioned in the podcast are going to be Linked down in the video description or In the show notes depending on where You're watching or listening to this if You're listening to this on a podcast Platform then do please leave us a Review on the iTunes Store it really Helps other people discover the podcast Or if you're watching this in full HD or 4k on YouTube then you can leave a Comment down below and ask any questions Or any insights or any thoughts about The episode that would be awesome and if You enjoyed this episode you might like To check out this episode here as well Which links in with some of the stuff That we talked about in the episode so Thanks for watching uh do hit the

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