Sponsored by Huel – go to and with your first order you’ll get a free t-shirt and shaker.
Sponsored by Trading 212 – download the Trading 212 app and use the promo code “ALI” after signing up and depositing to receive a random free share worth up to £100. This is not financial advice. Investments can fall and rise. Past performance is no guarantee of future results. Other fees may apply*. Capital is at risk.
Sponsored by WeWork – visit and use the code ‘ALI’ at checkout to redeem 50% off your first booking.
Matthew Dicks is an internationally bestselling author, podcaster, and a 59 time champion storyteller who teaches the storytelling to individuals, companies and universities. His latest book ‘Someday Is Today’ is an account of his journey to find purpose and meaning in life after experiencing traumatic and near death experiences as a young man – an almost fatal car crash and being robbed at gunpoint. He was also made homeless after leaving high school and put on trial (and then acquitted) for a crime he did not commit. In the conversation, we talk about Matthew’s story and some of the strategies he talks about in his book for getting from dreaming to doing and the practical ways to turn idle moments throughout your day into productive opportunities so you can move closer to your goals.
Season 5 Episode 13
00:00 Intro
01:38 Your background
05:43 What do most of your clients struggle with?
08:00 How to stop caring what others think
12:06 Being process vs results orientated
14:20 Your goal setting process
21:29 Your approach to productivity
24:24 How to use Horizon goals
35:27 Incrementalism
44:20 Your early life, homeless and motivation
49:50 Striving vs enjoying the present moment
52:55 Understanding regret
01:00:05 10 minutes is precious
01:08:38 Why you should break rules
01:20:06 Your near death experiences
01:29:20 Being arrested for a crime you didn’t commit
01:34:40 Parting thoughts
🔗 CONNECT WITH MATTHEW
📕 Someday Is Today –
📙 Storyworthy –
🐦 Twitter –
💻 Website –
🎙 Podcast –
🔗 CONNECT WITH ALI
🎥 YouTube Channel –
🐦 Twitter –
📸 Instagram –
💻 Website –
👥 Linkedin –
📄SHOW NOTES & TRANSCRIPT
Visit the website for the transcript and highlights from the conversation –
🎙 ABOUT THE PODCAST
Deep Dive is the podcast that delves into the minds of entrepreneurs, creators and other inspiring people to uncover the philosophies, strategies and tools that help us live happier, healthier and more productive lives.
🎧 LISTEN FOR FREE
Apple Podcasts –
Spotify –
RSS –
🙏 LEAVE A REVIEW
If you enjoyed listening to the podcast, we’d love for you to leave a 5-star review on Apple Podcasts to help others discover the show 🙂
👋🏼 GET IN TOUCH
You can also Tweet @AliAbdaal with any feedback, ideas or thoughts about the lessons you’ve learnt from the episodes and we can thank you personally for tuning in 🙏
PS: Some of the links in this description are affiliate links that I get a kickback from 😜
When I was 22. I was robbed at gunpoint Head on the floor of a restaurant gunned To my head a man counting back from Three and telling me when he hit zero He's going to shoot me in the head I was sure that I was going to die that Day and I will tell you that I did not Feel fear or sadness or anger the only Feeling I was consumed with was regret I Was 22 years old and I had failed to do Anything with my life that I had wanted To do [Music] Hey friends welcome back to Deep dive The weekly podcast where every week I Sit down with authors entrepreneurs Creators and other inspiring people to Find out how they got to where they are And the strategies and tools that we can Learn from them to apply to our own Lives now Matthew is the author of this Fantastic book storyworthy He's also an Elementary school teacher in the US he Is also a wedding DJ and an official Officiant at weddings and spend some Time in jail was arrested for a crime he Didn't commit most of the time none of The rules actually matter most of them Are made up arbitrarily you know I'm not Proposing people Rob but what I'm Proposing is test the world but the Conversation took a lot of weird turns It's kind of hard to describe the stuff We talked about but I can honestly say
This has been one of the favorite Conversations I've ever had on this Podcast people ask me like how did you Do all that and work 50 hours a week and I say after you're homeless and in jail And you have a gun to your head and you Think you're going to be in prison for 10 years nothing else is hard you know I Was hopeless and all you have to do is Take someone who's hopeless and give Them a little hope and nothing seems as Hard anymore You've got a ridiculously interesting Life Um you know you've been and and by Interesting I also mean like traumatic Uh in in some ways and as we were doing Research for this podcast people on our Team were like oh my gosh like it sounds Like he's had a really traumatic Upbringing I'm not sure if he's going to Be open to talking about the stuff and I Was kind of chuckling because you write About this stuff in your books and you Tell this stuff in your stories Um I guess can you for people who might Not know who you are can you give a sort Of spark note summary of what your life Has been and how we've kind of ended up Ended up talking to each other here Sure I guess we're talking to each other Primarily because I'm a Storyteller Amongst other things you know I'm a
Novelist and a writer and a columnist And 12 years ago On a whim because my friends sort of Encouraged me to do it I went to New York City and told a story on a stage in A in a competition and won and suddenly Discovered something that I enjoyed and And thought that I would just become a Storyteller who stood on stages in New York and Boston and maybe I would be Daring enough to travel somewhere else Someday and tell a story and I thought That was going to be it and uh last Night I was in New York at the same Competition for the moth sitting there Next to my friend Jenny and she said It's so weird that now you just consult With like Fortune 100 companies and In hospitals and Photojournalists and all of that stuff And you know so today I do a lot of that I work with just about every type of Person you can imagine It's supposed to be storytelling and Sometimes it is but as my wife will tell You she's sitting in the other room Listening I'll get off a call and she'll Say that had nothing to do with Storytelling you were basically helping That person navigate their life figure Out a way to handle a co-worker you know Navigate a difficult work situation I Work with a lot of people who Find themselves sort of in work
Environments where they can't trust the People or they can't rely on the people Around them for advice so you know I'm Working with a woman of color in Corporate America who can't show Weakness in the office because of who She is around and what she has needed to Do in order to get where she is and Suddenly this guy who is supposed to be Helping with her with a keynote Is also someone who understands how to Listen who has lived a life of You know many experiences and has some Wisdom and you know I get off the call And I say well we didn't talk about Storytelling there but I helped her You know figure out how to deal with her Boss better or I helped her lead her Team you know I'm helping I'm helping a Lot of Executives now on just basically Leadership like how do I get an employee That I have to do the things I need them To do and oddly because I've been a School teacher also for 24 years I'm Able to give those folks advice on how To change the behavior of the people They're working with so it is a really Strange life that I have now that that Resonates a lot because Um I remember after I read your book Storyworthy which um I was I I read it In 2020 and whenever I did my kind of Roundups of the year or things like that I always said Yep this was the single
Best book uh that I've read in 2020 and It was sick Um and just like although it sort of is Like a how to tell better stories it's Also like just itself an incredibly Moving and powerful and inspirational And like all of all of the adjectives Type book and then I remember emailing You Um being like hey do you do one-on-one Coaching because I like the idea of Improving my storytelling and I think we Did one or two sessions about Storytelling and then it immediately Turned into my weekly session with Matthew is sort of like a combination of Life coaching and therapy and helping me With my book and helping me helping me Overcome limiting beliefs and stuff Um so that like I'm I'm not surprised That that is uh the vibe that you have When you when you when you work with Other people as well Um I guess while we're on this topic What are some of the problems that you Know when when you're Consulting someone Who's a leader at a Fortune 100 company Or when you're Consulting someone like Me or when you consider like you know People across across a wide range of Things I guess what are the common Problems that our listeners might be Able to relate to that you find come up Um kind of time and time again
Confidence is an enormous problem for a Lot of people I I find that there's a Lot of self-doubt in the world and There's an enormous belief that everyone Is looking at everyone you know the Spotlight effect the idea that If you come to work and you have a bad Hair day everyone's going to know you Had a bad hair day or if you're in a Meeting and you say the wrong thing Everyone will forever remember that Thing and and that is a debilitating Belief that a lot of people have where They can't move through life without Constantly worrying about what happened Five minutes ago and so I work really Hard with people to sort of Encompass And embrace the idea that No one pays as much attention to you as You think they do and when you release That worry and that concern you can Become enormously happy and more Productive because suddenly all the Things that you're doing to sort of Maintain an image that is utterly Unnecessary once all those things Fall Away you suddenly find yourself free Both in terms of the bandwidth you have To be thinking about the things you want To do but also just frankly time you Know I am obsessive about minutes and I Am obsessive about the idea that people Waste their minutes on things that no One notices nobody cares and don't lead
Them in the right direction so that is a Real struggle for people Just confidence it's an enormous problem For a lot of people So the idea that yeah you know people Aren't thinking about you as much as you Think they are uh most people would kind Of Nod when they hear that in theory Um and I've given that advice so many Times and yet I also then spend Inordinate amounts of time worrying that Oh that thing that I said at that party Where I kind of made a joke and it kind Of went a bit flat was that a bit like Was that was that a bit weird it's you Know and then this sort of translates to Everything like when I'm writing the Book when I'm doing YouTube stuff Podcast guests like oh did the guest Thing that was a bit weird stuff like That Um I guess beyond the intellectual Understanding that that's probably like The spotlight effect exists what are Some things that you found helpful in Actually coaching people through the Process of actually not caring what People think if if that's what we're Trying to go for yeah one of the things I do is sort of a thought experiments With people I just had one with someone The other day she is a person who is Really uh invested in Her Image her Physical image and she says it's just
It's what gets me through my day and I Said let's go back to the last holiday Party you attended can you think of it And she said yes I remember it was a Christmas party I said do you remember What you wore she said yes I had to buy A dress it was my husband's holiday Party for his business it was important That I looked good I said did you spend A lot of time figuring it out and she Said I did but it was important and I Said tell me what anyone else at the Holiday party was wearing that night And she paused for a long time and then Said I can't even remember what my husband Was wearing that night and I said so do You think that everyone else can Remember what you were wearing if you Can't remember what anyone else was Wearing and so that idea of sort of Moving through life and either Reframing the way you think about things Or these wonderful experiments I send People on which is go grocery shopping In your pajamas just go go in your Pajamas and see what happens because It's not gonna destroy you if you do it Once and you might suddenly discover That nobody cares what you look like in The grocery store now I'm not suggesting Grocery shopping in pajamas is a Preferred Behavior it's not going to Help you but what I'm trying to do is to
Get them to move through life in a way That you don't have to put your makeup On every day you don't have to make sure That your tie and your pocket square and The socks that are peeking out Underneath the Cuffs of your pants that They're all uniquely aligned all of Those things when we can let go of them Life just gets happier and easier and Better definitely agree I think I think That's great stuff Um one thing our viewers or listeners Might be thinking is well easy for you To say you're a dude I'm a woman in Corporate America and I get told when I Don't wear makeup that I look tired and I know that people are Perhaps not consciously but at least Subconsciously judging me based on my Appearance and like how how does that Fit in because I I'm I imagine you must Have kind of talked to people about this As well yes I always tell people let's Start off with the fact that I'm a white Straight American man with no physical Disabilities and no mental illness so I Am genetically the most fortunate human Being who has ever existed on planet Earth I have the most advantages I've Never walked into a room and thought Nobody wants to hear from me I've always Assumed everyone wants to hear every Single thing I have to say But what I tell people is
First if people say you look tired if You're not wearing your makeup it's only Because everyone else in the room is Wearing makeup and if it would all just Go away we would all just look normal Right so part of the problem is not that You look tired but you just look Different than the other people who are Highly invested in their image at this Moment so so that's sort of a construct That if we could bring everybody down a Little that would help everyone in the Long run but ultimately it's about Performance if you are an outstanding Person at your job it does not matter if You come to work looking tired because If you're producing results and you are Productive and profitable and your People are succeeding nobody will care If you look tired and so if you're Worried about it that if I look tired I'm not going to get the promotion I'm Looking for it's probably more to do With what you're doing in your job Because no one has hired you for what You look like and you're never going to Hold on to your job or be promoted Because of the way you look it is Ultimately going to come down to Performance and we have to embrace that I have to perform well which is really Not even as you know not results Oriented for me but process oriented you Know I know the things I have to do and
I let go of the things I can't control But as long as you're doing the things You know you have to do those are the Things Fall Away Can we zoom in zoom into that point what Do you mean when you say that you're a Process versus results oriented because I know that you and I have talked about This uh a sort of in-depth but I would I Would love to hear your take on it for For the benefit of the viewers well you Know what I've I set goals every year I've done it for about 15 years and I Publish them on the Internet so people Can see what my goals are and for the First few years I was setting goals the Problem I had was I was setting goals That I didn't actually have any control Over so I would say things like I am Going to publish a book this year and That was actually one of my goals early On that's a ridiculous goal because that Is dependent upon many factors outside Of my control I can say I will write a Book this year I can say I will write a Book that I deem to be outstanding I Could even write a book that is deemed Outstanding by a collection of my Friends right that they believe is Publishable but to actually get a Published book it requires an Editor to Fall in love with the book and a Publisher to agree with the editor and An offer to be made and an agent to
Agree and all of these things I have no Control over whatsoever so all of my Goals that I set with the exception of a Couple because I'm mean to myself like I Set goals about winning moth story slams Because attending the moth story slime Is just too easy for me I decided to set A couple that are gonna Be be really cruel to me but most of Them almost all of them are I'm going to Do a thing and I'm going to bring it to The point that I can release it to the World and then what the world does with It is sort of beyond my control so I Think it's so important for people to Set goals that are not dependent upon The whims of other people because when That happens we fail for reasons we have No control over and I believe in failing You know I have my average goal Completion rate for the past 15 years is Hovering right around 65 and I love that Number because if there's ever a year That I get to a hundred percent I'm Gonna say to myself I failed to push Myself because I should never really Accomplish 100 of my goals because if I Do I left something on the table so I love Failure I believe in not accomplishing Everything you set out to do I think That is a signal that you have pushed Yourself beyond what was possible and I Think that's the way I want to live
What is your sort of is it is it that You set goals at the start of the year Like what what does your goal setting Process look like it starts in December So in December I will look at the Previous year's goals and analyze them And decide which ones I'm going to keep You know because they need to either Continue on to the next year uh push-ups For example has been a goal of mine for 10 years I know that if I don't set a Goal of doing 100 push-ups a day for Five days a week I know that at some Point I might not do them but if they're On the goals I will absolutely find a Way to do those hundred push-ups so That's one that I'll evaluate and say it Must stay some will be completed I'll Say good I did that one I don't have to Repeat it again some will I will look at And say my intention was to do that goal This year I didn't end up doing it Because halfway through the year I Decided it wasn't worth it I didn't want To do it anymore it wasn't viable it Wasn't realistic and that will fall off And then I'll start looking in December At new goals for the next year and at The same time I post on my blog does Anyone have goals that they think I Should take a look at things that I Should be doing that I'm not doing and That includes my friends who jump in and Say you're an idiot in this regard you
Should really clean this up it includes Strangers who say I've been reading your Stuff for a long time here's an area You've never explored before maybe you Want to explore it and it includes People who say this is a thing I love I Think you might love it too you should Probably try to pursue this and then Throughout the month of December which Is always my favorite month I start Collecting those goals and I start Deciding which ones are appropriate Which ones are not and then what level I Will set for each one of those goals and By January 1st I post it and then on June 30th I always take an evaluation I'm halfway through the year where am I What are still realistic have I Let Go Of some because for whatever reason the Forces of the universe have deemed this Can no longer be a goal and I'm more Than willing to add goals on throughout The year although honestly I do it very Very rarely I tend to hold what I have And occasionally release a goal if it Doesn't make sense anymore So what's an example of some of these Well some of these goals like what are Your goals for this year for example I Have 52 of them I just finished one Today okay yeah I just finished one Today uh my goal this year and has been For the past five years is to write 100 Physical letters like hey like we're
Handwritten or typed that are printed Put in an envelope with a stamp and Mailed out into the world uh and I just Finished that this today I wrote a Letter and that was the 100th one that I'm going to be sending out so so that's Important to me I have discovered that Writing letters is incredibly beneficial And enormous number of ways like so much Goodness has come back to me from Writing letters that that will always be A goal for me is to write 100 letters a Year what do you mean so much goodness Has come back to you oh well for example On teacher appreciation day I wrote four Letters to four of my favorite teachers In the world I found their addresses and I wrote to them yesterday I had brunch With one of them an English Professor From 30 years ago who called me up Received my letter said come and have Brunch with me I'd love to sit down and Talk we talked for two hours which was Beautiful that's enough goodness turns Out she owns horse is new I grew up on a Horse farm my children have never ridden Horses before even though they've heard Me tell stories about being on horses For my childhood so in two weeks I'm Going to take my children up to the Horse to the horses that she owns and She's gonna let my kids ride their her Horses for the first time in their life And things like that happen to me all
The time and another teacher who I wrote To now lives about two hours south of me On the cape on the ocean as it invited Me and my family to come for the day now We can't make it work this summer but We'll make it work next summer and so Part of it is just you send the letter Out because it means something to Someone it's a physical manifestation of Your thought and it's so much more Valuable than saying something kind to Someone because they get to hold on to It and they get to reread it because There's not enough positivity in the World you know I also do things like I Send Pride Flags to bigoted human beings In our country like whenever I hear a a Politician somewhere in the United States sort of standing against same-sex Marriage I have a small collection of Pride Flags or actually I have a large Collection of small Pride flags and I Stick them in an envelope with an angry Note and I mail it out and that makes me Feel better like and nothing good comes Back ever from that but it genuinely Makes me feel good that they're going to Open an envelope or one of their Staffers is going to open an envelope And find a pride flag in it and they're Going to have to do something with that Probably throw it away but they're going To have to confront it but I just it's a Good goal that I think everyone should
Have but that's just one of I mean 52 You know there's lots of writing goals For me because I'm a writer there's a Lot of performance goals like what am I Going to do in terms of being on stages I'm building a business so there's Business related goals and then there's Lots of personal goals like I have a best friend for the past 37 Years that we don't see in we don't see Each other enough so one of my goals This year was just make sure you see him Six times this year like we talk on the Phone we text all the time but we don't Actually physically see each other even Though we live 15 minutes apart so six Times this year every other month I'm Gonna make sure I spend time with Benji So those kinds of goals mean a lot to me Too When you're when you're collecting the Goals do you split them up into like Categories or is it just anything go Like yeah what are the categories yeah So there's writing which is sort of my That part of my business so all of the Writing goals get piled up there there's A performance or a storytelling goal Which is standing on stages but also the Business that I'm building which is Directly related to storytelling I have Personal goals which are things like Hanging out with my friend taking one Photo every day of my kids taking a
Photo of me and my wife once a week Because we never take photos together I have organizational goals I'm sort of An organizational not in that regard so Like my basement is always a goal Because I just can't get a hold of it Because other human beings in my house Create problems for me so and then I Always have a list of like new goals Like something that doesn't quite fit a Category it's brand new it's something That's landed this year I'm gonna see What it's like and so those end up there Too nice yeah I remember when we were When I was setting my goals for the uh No I think it was last year actually When you and I first started to speak I Became very like yeah I want to I want To take art lessons I want to get better At guitar music theory piano and I tried All these things and I actually did take Our lessons like three times a week for A few months and we could talk twice a Week guitar lessons and twice a week Piano lessons and after a while I was Like okay this is now getting a bit much It's time for me to drop those and just Stick them in the someday maybe list Because at some point in the future I Would like to take art lessons but at That season of my life I felt like it Was too much and I was rocking up to the Art lessons thinking oh I know this is Supposed to be fun but I'm kind of why
Am I waking up at seven in the morning Like I've got to open a zoom call Straight afterwards and kind of the Attitude that I was approaching them With was not an attitude of like Lightness and ease and play and I like At least for my goals I like to I like To sort of treat them as a bit of a game Rather than something I'm taking Particularly seriously Um I guess how what's what's your You know some some people like your your Latest book some days today which is Sick um is I guess on the surface a Productivity book and there are some People that like oh productivity is for Losers productivity is all about just Like grinding yourself to the ground and Not having any fun uh but you don't Strike me as that kind of guy so what I Guess what's your broad approach to These goals and to productivity in General I like to think that productivity is Really dream oriented that Everyone should have a dream and if they Don't they probably do and they're not Admitting to it or they do that terrible Thing where they don't actually spend Time thinking about themselves one of The tragedies of the world is we spend All of our time thinking about our Parents and our spouses and our children And our business and our clients and our
Customers but it's very rare that Someone sits down and just says I'm Going to think about me for a little While how I got here you know where am I Going what are my goals as a Storyteller I'm obsessed with finding stories so I Have something new to say on stage so Storytellers tend to be deeply curious About themselves we're self-centered in What I say is a positive way just Meaning we afford ourselves times to Think about us so in terms of Productivity you first have to have the Dream or a multitude of dreams you have To have a horizon that's when I like to Think of it as what's your horizon What's the point on the horizon but that Point on the horizon can be I've always Wanted to have a backyard vegetable Garden you know or I was talking to a Client the other day and I said well What's your horizon goal and she said I Want to see the 50 great movies of all Time there's a list in the world I'd Have the list and I want to sit on my Couch and watch the 50 greatest movies She said but that doesn't feel super Productive and I said that sounds Incredibly productive to me because it's Your dream so when people say Productivity sort of grinds you down I Think of productivity as it's the thing That you want to be doing that you Should be doing more of so let's
Maximize our life the things we have to Do in order to sustain life in order to Get to the things we want to do so we Don't have to think of productivity in Terms of work we can if you're one of Those people who have enormous work Dreams and and money dreams and how Streams and vacation dreams that's great Like those are all valuable goals if That means something to you but if your Goal is to sit on the couch more and Watch black and white movies with your Husband and make sure you see all of Them before you die all the ones you're Supposed to see that's a wonderful goal Let's make sure we maximize your work Time you are for chore time let's take Away all of those little black holes of Your life that you're wasting and make Sure that we use all that so you can get Your ass on the couch more often with Your husband watching black and white Movies I think that's the way to dispel That productivity nonsense which is we Have to grind ourselves it's just dream Oriented choose the right dream And then productivity will make total Sense to you that's nice I like that Terminology like all right what's your Horizon goal um and I guess We can have Horizon goals for different Areas of our life like if I imagine for Like my book The Horizon goal is oh Actually brought more more broadly I'd
Like to be an author who writes books Every few years because it seems kind of Fun Um and then I guess I can break that Down into more concrete steps like is That how you approach it you figure out The Horizon goal and you break it down Like what's what's your process for this Yeah well I like a horizon goal because I think that You know if we're thinking about a dream Or that thing on the horizon I think When people Define it very specifically It's a mistake you know I originally Thought I was going to be a Storyteller Who told stories on stages in New York And Boston and maybe somewhere else in The world and if I had made that Horizon Point sort of defined and specific I Would have only moved in that direction I like thinking of Horizons because That it's sort of very wide it's a Distant point that you can't quite see It's the acknowledgment that the roads You're on the path you're taking might Not actually land you and the place you Thought you would land but you'll land In the vicinity it's an it's an Approximation of the dream you know even With sort of a book I start writing a Novel it always starts with a what if Question and I think I know what the end Is going to be it never has been the end I allow the book to sort of dictate
Where the where the final moment of this Character is going to be and I just see It as a horizon but sometimes I go wow That was quite left of whatever I Thought it was going to land but it's in The vicinity it's not behind me it's Always somewhere in the front so I like To identify that idea of I'm going to be A Storyteller but that I'm going to be a Storyteller also allows because it's on The horizon to be maybe I'll teach Storytelling someday maybe I'll be a Consultant about storytelling maybe Maybe an advertising company will allow Me to inject storytelling into their car Commercial which is what I've done right All of those things are sort of on the Storytelling Horizon but it affords me The opportunity to be flexible in terms Of what ultimately is going to happen All right we're just going to take a Quick break from the podcast to Introduce our sponsor which is very Excitingly heal I have been a pain Customer of huel since 2017 so it's been About six years now that I've been using Q fairly regularly I started eating Hill In my fifth year of medical school and I've been using heel regularly ever Since because you know I like to be Productive I've you know my calendar is Full with a lot of things and often I Don't have the time or don't make the Time to have a particularly healthy
Breakfast or a particularly healthy Lunch my favorite flavor is salted Caramel because for 400 calories you get 40 grams of protein which is absolutely Insane and you also get a decent healthy Mix of carbohydrates and fiber and fat Along with 26 different vitamins and Minerals which are all very good for the Body there's nine different flavors of This to choose from my favorite is a the Banana version and also the Salted Caramel version so what I do is I take My two scoops I put them into my NutriBullet blender type thing although You can just use a normal Shaker if you Want I mix it up normally with water but A little bit of milk to add a bit more Of a milkshake like consistency to it And then I just sip that while I'm on my Desk doing my work in the morning and it Ensures that I get a very healthy Breakfast in that's nutritionally Complete rather than and some high sugar Cereal which is what I would have Defaulted to instead also heal is Ridiculously reasonably priced like a Meal 400 calories comes out to one pound 68 per meal which is super super cheap Compared to what the alternative would Be if you were ordering takeout for Example anyway if you like the idea of Getting these cheap and healthy and Nutritionally complete meals in your Diet then head over to heel.com forward
Slash Deep dive and if you use that URL Heal.com forward slash Deep dive they Will send you a free t-shirt which are Quite nice and also a free kind of Shaker bottle type thing with your first Order so thank you so much heal for Sponsoring this episode this episode is Very kindly brought to you by Trading212. now people ask me all the Time for advice about investing because I've made a bunch of videos about it on The YouTube channel and my advice for Most people is generally invest in Broad Stock market index funds which is Exactly what you can do completely for Free with trading 212. it's a great app That lets you trade stocks and funds and ETFs and foreign exchange if you really Want to and one of the great things About the app is that if you're new to The world of investing you can actually Invest with fake money you don't have to Put real money in they've got a practice Mode where you invest fake money and Then it actually tracks what the market Is doing in real time so you can see had I invested 100 pounds into this thing What would my return have been X weeks Or X months further down the line once You've got some comfort with that then It's super easy to deposit money into Your trading tube into account you can Use Apple pay like I do initially or you Can use a direct bank transfer and then
Once the money is in your trading 212 Account then you can invest it in Basically whatever you want the other Really cool feature about trading 212 is Their pies feature so what you can do is You can follow people who've created Investing pies for example someone might Have a pie where I don't know 30 of its Apple and 20 is Tesla and 10 is the S P 500 and you can follow people on the app And see what pies they've created and You can see the performance of those Pies and then you can just copy and Paste a particular pie into your own Account and so that means like let's say You've got 100 pounds to invest and You've put 50 of it into the S P 500 but You want to be a little bit more Experimental with the other 50 pounds You could invest it into a pie where Someone else is generally a pro or Someone in their bedroom is just loves The markets has already done all the Homework for you the app also lets you Auto invest which is a great thing Because then you can automatically Invest a percentage of your paycheck Into the thing every month and so if you Haven't yet started when investing and You want to give it a go then you you Can download the app on the App Store And if you use the coupon code Ali Ali At the checkout that will give you a Totally free share worth up to 100
Pounds it's available on iPhone and Android and you can check it out by Typing in trading212 into your Respective App Store so thank you so Much trading212 for sponsoring this Episode okay so let's say I have which I Sort of do a horizon goal of I'd like to Be a musical performer of some kind Um I did this was actually when I you Know back in like 2008 when I discovered YouTube uh the channels I was mostly Following were the YouTube music cover Artists and I'd watch them play the Piano or the guitar and sing along to Some cover of a popular song and think Damn that's sick I really want to do Something like that and I had a few full Stars I dabbled with a few videos here And there over the years and it was only Like 10 years later that I was like you Know what let me sit down and teach what I know about how to get into med school That I actually became a YouTuber so it Sort of ended up going in a completely Different direction but I have always Had in the back of my mind that At some point someday Um I would like to Um oh yeah I'd like to explore that Interest a little bit more I love the Idea of learning how to play instruments Myself and learning music theory and Learning how to compose and arrange and Then singing either myself or with
Friends to two popular songs so that's Like a vague Horizon goal I guess like I Like that would be yeah yeah that makes Sense to me yeah yeah so I think next in Terms of breaking it down or like yeah What's the process well it sounds to me Like you're not quite sure like what You know path that's you're going to Take to the Horizon and I and I like That too you know I think the mistake People would make would be I am going to Get a record contract I am going to be a Lead singer in a rock band with a record Contract that is a bad idea I think what You've said is I want to do something in Music And I kind of want to be a person maybe Making music and making people happy With that music right but if that Horizon means you know what I discovered I'm actually a really good DJ I don't Need to learn how to play a music Because I can actually scratch and that Actually fills that need for me or it Could be turns out I can't play Instruments but what I can do is I can Find people who play them really well And I can help them make better music And become a music producer right that's That's in that general area and I think It's when people say no I will not be Happy unless I have a record contract And I'm in a rock band and I'm Performing in arenas that's the only
Thing that's going to make me happy I think that's a terrible sort of Approach to life so I like your approach Which is I kind of want to do something In music I think I want to play music But you know open to other things and Then I would just do what you're doing Which is begin the exploration start Walking down the path you know all right Let me try a guitar for a while right my Wife wanted to play the guitar and then She quickly realized you know what the Ukulele is better than the guitar it's Easier to play it's smaller and I can Use it in my kindergarten classroom so She became a ukulele player she's pretty Good and then one day I said are you Ever gonna sing with the ukulele and she Said I don't know I'm not that good of a Singer but it turns out with the ukulele It doesn't demand you to be a good Singer because the instrument is so sort Of Small and light and amusing that you Don't have to sort of sing really Beautifully you can just sing well so She has become a ukulele player who Plays music to her kindergarten students And changes the way they learn because Of it not her original goal which is I Want to play the guitar someday but it's Become this thing and all she did was She started on the path she took Positive steps forward most people spend
An enormous amount of time thinking About what they should do to get to the Horizon rather than saying well this is One possible step I could take I'm going To take the one possible step and if It's not the right one I will take Another possible step but I cannot tell You how many people I meet who say well I'm still trying to plot out my thing And I always say all the thinking you're Doing about reaching your goal is Meaningless and useless and it doesn't Count for anything if you're just Thinking about getting there you're Doing nothing take a step forward even If that means going online and buying a Ukulele that's the first step grade you Made a positive step today a ukulele is Coming to your home think about what the Next thing you can do is I love that yeah Um thinking about this exact audio this Morning um because so every every Morning I carve out three or four hours To do book stuff and I was working on uh One of the chapters around Procrastination and how Um when we're procrastinating from a Thing that we either want to do or need To do often the first step is actually To just Define what is the next step Because I think that you know you know In my in my world where people are Struggling to start YouTube channels and
Stuff it's always like thinking 100 Steps ahead of like oh but like what's My Niche gonna be eventually which is Going to allow me to monetize and blah Blah blah blah blah so I was like no man Just like you know focus on like you Know get going like what is what is the Next step And there's a line from the end of one Of Brandon sanderson's books uh Oathbringer where it's like um the most Important step a person can take is just The next one yeah I think about that a Lot I think with any goal that I have What is the next step I can take this Week in one sitting that will just make Progress in some way and as long as I'm Not wedded to the pace of progress or to The destination particularly at least It's you know it's it's creating Movement and movement generally for me At least leads to motivation and then Makes life feel good and all that stuff Yeah well your story of how you sort of Became what you are was a perfect Example of that like I thought I was going to be a person Invested in YouTube in the musical realm And then one day I decided to make a Video on how I got into med school right Which never would have been your initial Thought on how this would ever happen For you but you remained open enough to Say well let me try something else I
Know what my goal is which is I want to Appear on a screen for millions of People around the world in a educational Or inspiring way but your story is Exactly what I am talking about you know The idea of incrementalism is so Important people don't believe in it the Idea that tiny changes accumulated over Time produce enormous results most People want a Big Gulp a magic pill they Want to instantly have a million Subscribers they want to have a perfect YouTube video they want to have a book Contract before they actually write the Book or even before they even write the Proposal right everyone sort of wants This enormous leap and if you examine The success stories which I always Believe you should do is like just Examine the success stories of people in The world so that you can get a sense of What those success stories are all of Them involve tiny incremental changes Piling up over time that eventually Produce enormous results but people Don't believe in it because they can't See it immediately you know I just Recently started I learned that people Who have better balance live longer Because if you get older and you don't Have good balance you fall and those Falls put you in the hospital and old People in the hospital die you you know That it's probably better than I do and
So one of the tricks I Learned was when You're brushing your teeth stand on one Foot during the first minute of brushing Your teeth and see if you can maintain That one foot and then switch to the Other one and so I've started doing that And I've asked people or I've told People this is a really good idea you Know to help you improve your balance And someone came back to me and said After a month well I don't really see my Balance improving And I said well first of all you didn't Really gauge your balance you didn't Assess your balance on day one to day 30. so it's impossible for you to even Say that but I said this is incremental Change you're not even supposed to see It you're not even supposed to expect to See it you just have to believe that Every single day that you spend a minute On each foot twice a day if you're Brushing your teeth twice a day which You should be Over time the piling up of small things Will produce enormous results but you Can't expect to see the results Immediately and if you do That's when people fail to sort of make Changes in their life that are Meaningful yeah yeah no I've I've never Really thought of this before but I Guess kind of my whole foray into Musical YouTube land
Like in the four or five year period Before I actually started being a proper YouTuber and making this Medical School Educational content it was like on Average one video a year where you know One one time filmed it with phones Another time got a microphone another Time got a camera another time learned How to edit I even wrote a blog post Talking about my editing process in Premiere Pro for making music videos and How I discovered that if you just put Black bars at the top of the page it Like makes it look widescreen and more Cinematic and all this stuff and I guess Like all that stuff was this little Steps I was taking in the vague Direction of like hey this YouTube thing Seems kind of cool I reckon music is the Kind of way forward and that meant that When I decided you know what let's Actually make these videos for medical Students I already had a camera I Already had a microphone I already had Known how to edit having done it like Once or twice five years ago and so that That next step was a lot easier than it Is for a lot of my students in my YouTuber Academy where it's just Completely overwhelming from day one and There's a lot of overthinking that that Goes on in the process yeah it's the Steps we take That we just have to have belief like I
Opened my book with the word hope I Think hope is so important the belief That when you're taking steps forward Somewhere down the road it's going to Help you know I made the mistake once Someone asked me how did you become a Storyteller and in a workshop I said You know when I was 40 I took a stage And I just suddenly found something I Was naturally good at I got lucky at a Later point in life that I I suddenly Could do something I didn't know I could Do and my wife was in the room and she Said is that really what you think from The back of the room she goes is that Really what you think And I said yeah that's what I've been Telling people because I mean how do you Explain it I took a stage I won and I Instantly became one of the winningest Storytellers in moth history and Nationally recognized within a year and She said you don't think the fact that You've been writing stories ever since You were 17 that you've written every Single day of your life since you were 17 years old played a role that night in Your understanding of how stories work And I said oh I guess that's probably True and she said and you've been a Wedding DJ for a quarter of a century You have been standing in front of People half drunk on a microphone Learning to speak extemporaneously
Ridding yourself of every bit of Nervousness you ever could have speaking In front of human beings you don't think That that landed on that stage that Night and I went oh yeah I guess that's True too and she said and you've been an Elementary school teacher all you do all Day is stand in front of 10 year olds And tell them stories so that you can Teach them long division you just Entertain kids in order to keep them Learning that is your style of teaching It's the worst audience in the world and You perform every day for them she said You don't think that helped and I had Never occurred to me but it's that like Work you're doing that you don't realize You're doing that might someday pile Into something that changes your life Right you became a YouTuber oddly Because you became a doctor And had you not become a doctor you Might not actually be doing what you're Doing now right and so like the work you Did which really I always say was Positive forward movement progress on a Goal regardless of what that is we have To have hope and belief that the work We're doing now won't necessarily land Us in the place we expected but that the Skills and the experiences that we're Acquiring will land us in a place and I Really believe the people who take the Most steps forward in irregardless of
What the direction is they're taking Those steps forward the ones who are Actually doing things every day positive Steps forward in a Direction they think Makes sense lands them in a in a Positive place at the end of their life Or at some point in their life but I Just don't think people recognize that Because they don't credit that Incremental growth and what it could Yield it's this weird belief that people Have that they could actually predict Their own future they have so much Hubris that they think they know what Next year will be I love people who tell Me they have a five-year plan I think It's just stupidest thing you understand It right imagine five years ago if you Had said what my Five-Year Plan is you Would never have guessed where you are Today and that has been the same for me For every single five years of my life And I think it's only because I'm Constantly relentlessly finding the next Thing I want to step forward on and all Of those things will accumulate to Something Yeah that was a that was a great piece Of advice that I got from one of the Consultant Physicians that I worked with In my fourth year of med school he asked Me you know you know I kind of got on And we were in the emergency department Grabbing a coffee and he was like Hey
You know so what specialty do you want To do and I was like ah yeah I've still Got three years of med school I don't I Don't need to figure it out like I I Don't really know and he said you know What if I were you I would just pick Something and start moving in that Direction because it's a lot easier to Change direction when you're moving than When you're static it's great I'm Stealing that and using it forever that Is good and then I decided you know What plastic surgery is a way forward And then I started taking steps in that Direction and then I attended this Hackathon where my skills and web design That I've been doing for 10 years came In handy to for us to win this prize for This plastic surgery surgical app thing Made friends with a few plastic surgeons Joined the board of a plastic surgery Organization ended up getting hired as Like a freelance ux designer for medical Tech companies while doing my elective Which meant I could make a profit in my Life is like all these random things Happened I decided in the end I don't Want to do plastic surgery going to move Towards Obstetrics and Gynecology but Like just taking steps in that direction Led to so many interesting things that I'm just yeah really thankful to uh Dr Adcock for that for that piece of advice That is great it is easier to change
Direction if you're moving forward is so Great because most people are just Sitting in place contemplating what they Should do I actually I've worked with Some of you YouTubers they've come out Of your Academy and they've worked with Me privately and the thing they always Tell me is Ali tells me I have to just make stuff That I have to stop worrying about what It looks like and what it sounds like All of that will come but the first Thing you have to do is make a video and I every time I go he's right you should Post something today and they're like Well I'm not ready today I'm like yes You are just put up something and They're like well what if it's bad I Said then take it down do you really Think people are scouring the internet Like if I watch a bad YouTube video it Doesn't stay with me I'm not like three Days later going that lady that lady who Wasted nine minutes of my life that Doesn't happen we just move on with our Lives right we don't worry about the Failures and so that message that you're Putting out there I hear it all the time They don't follow it though as often as We want them to I really believe that People hear us but so many times they Sit and wait because of fear because of Concerns of failure because they don't Think they can do it because they're
Chasing Perfection the worst thing you Could ever do in your life is to you Know try to be perfect ever but Especially out of the gate all of those Things cause them not to move forward Yeah Yeah like how how how do we get more People to take that advice I guess like Or or rather how You know in in your life how did you get Over that initial thing which has now Resulted in you being so prolific and Like writing and forming and all this Stuff I I guess for whatever reason I think Probably because you know I grew up Without parents who are sort of paying Attention in any way and you know after High school I had a tough period of life You know homeless in jail and Violence and things like that I think because there was never sort of The ability to Chase The goal the process always was valuable To me because no one was ever at the end With a trophy or a monetary award or Even an acknowledgment that I did Something well And so I was never thinking I'm gonna go do that thing so that Someone will reward me in a significant Way it was always sort of me you know I Only had me and so for me I was always Thinking
I'll just get this thing done and That'll be a good step you know my first Novel I never expected it to be Published But I damn well expected it to be Written because that was all on me I'm Going to write a book someday and I'm Going to write a book that I think is Good because I had maybe six starts of Novels that got 10 000 words in before Thankfully I had the the wisdom and The Taste to read those Ten Thousand Words And go not good this is a terrible Terrible book I cannot continue this one But I did I knew I'll write a book Someday and I secretly believed actually I openly believe that if I write a book I'm going to be better than most of the People in the world because most people Say they're going to write a book and Most don't almost no one does and Everyone thinks they will so if I just Write a book I've already achieved Something that was genuinely how I felt And once I finished it I said to my wife Well I'll try to get it published Because you can't write a book and not Try to get it published but probably not Going to happen I told her and I had Already started my second one I said Well I can do one now I'll do two so I'm Writing my second novel I'm trying to Get the first one published never ever Ever and if it hadn't happened if all I
Did was had a book that maybe I had Bound you know had a few copies made for Family members that would have genuinely Been an enormous achievement for me and I would have recognized it as an Enormous achievement so I think it was Just for me maybe I got fortunate in the Fact that I was ignored for so often That I had to really become You know self assessing and because There was no authority figure declaring Success I had to find success for myself Which was which quickly became process Oriented another thing that I really Encourage people to think about I was Just doing it with someone yesterday I Think sometimes people see a goal or a Dream is a linear process Like A to B to C and I think that's always a mistake Too so I was working with someone Yesterday who said I want to write a Memoir and I said we'll start writing a Memoir and she said I don't know where To start and I said do you have some Good moments that you know you want to Include she said oh yeah I said well Write those she said don't you have to Start a book at the beginning I said no You write something just write chapter 15 if that's what you can write today Like save chapter one for the day you Can write chapter one but write whatever You can on a given day and that applies For everything that we're doing sort of
You know as I'm building a business is Absolutely the next thing I'm supposed To do but if I don't want to do that Thing for some reason my motivation to To do that task on that day is not there I do recognize there are a multitude of Other tasks that will need to be Completed so I will go deal with those Tasks today so rather than seeing goals As linear just see it as it's a series Of things that need to be done and in Terms of time management that helps a Lot too because if your next thing that You have to complete takes two hours Sometimes people will just wait for a Two-hour period when there's also like a 10 minute project and a 15-minute Project and maybe a six hour project but Can actually be broken down into 10 Minute increments it does not need to be Done in the full six hours all at once So seeing your dream as Stepping stones but you get to touch Whichever one you want at any point Because you're gonna have to touch all Of them eventually that's really helpful And then I also think momentum is Enormous when people want to lose weight What I always tell them is Weigh yourself every day because it Fluctuates daily and start the day of Weight loss on that day when you step on The scale and you suddenly go oh wow That's weird I lost two pounds yesterday
You know maybe you missed lunch you did Some extra walking you didn't drink as Much water as you did and suddenly You're two pounds less that's the best Day to start a a weight loss program Because you've already lost two pounds Like you suddenly are excited about Something excitement leads to motivation Motivation leads to momentum so you have To just sort of start building up some Wins along the way so that's when I'm Trying to get people to like take that First step to to do the thing I give Them easy wins like ordering that Ukulele is an easy win if you have the Money it doesn't take much to order it And that means it's going to arrive and That's an easy win too that's an Exciting thing you know and after it Arrives well do you have a music book Get that easy win now you have a music Book right and now can you just learn to Play an E just an e at the end of the Day you're like wow I can play an E Right it'll take you five minutes to Learn to do an E but you just you're Gonna have to learn a knee someday That's a step you're gonna have to touch So touch that one today so I think those Kinds of things get people moving a Little more productively or a quicker You know rather than sitting where they Are thinking about what to do next Um I'd love to dive into the whole idea
Of Um kind of making every minute count but Before we do so um how do you feel so we We've talked a lot about sort of the Pursuit of a goal and kind of moving Forward and stuff Um in something you know I've heard some People say and I've I've kind of Struggled with this thought process Myself which is that what's this balance Between I guess striving for the next Thing versus enjoying the present moment I just had this conversation with my Wife I'm working on the proposal for my Next book you know even though I just Had this one come out and I have another Book sort of done I'm I'm I'm I'm way Ahead and yeah I was sort of complaining About this book proposal I had to write And my wife said you've published six Novels You've published them all over the Country and all over the world and you Have two books of non-fiction now can You just enjoy it for one damn second Can you just be happy with yourself Instead of constantly thinking you're Not good until you're working on the Next thing And I heard her clearly What I don't think she understands for Me is that it is the pursuit of the next Thing that is so joyous to me whether That Pursuit is the next book or I took
My first flying lesson last week and it Might be my last flying lesson but I Wanted to try it you know It's always the next thing I see sort of Complacency and satisfaction as Stagnation and death I I just I want to Have the widest fullest life possible With as many things in it as I can Possibly fit so I can have as many Experiences while always prioritizing my Children my wife oddly my cats those Types of things but when those Priorities are sort of taken care of I Just want to I want to expand it as much As possible so You know I think that we should Celebrate our achievements I believe in sort of my friend Jenny Just wrote a novel I think she should Have a she hasn't done anything with it Yet but I think she should have a party That says I wrote a novel and you didn't Come and have cake I think I really Believe in that But I think that if Jenny writes one Novel and she never writes another one And she decides to spend the rest of her Life watching Netflix and you know Drinking craft brew on her deck and That's what's going to make her happy I Will suggest to Jenny that when she's a Hundred she will think differently about How she spent those years uh because the Joy and of the completion of a goal that
You've always had should just lead to The next joy of the next completion of The next goal you should have This is pretty controversial I I imagine Some people are sitting here listening Or watching to this thinking that Guy like I enjoy watching Netflix for Three hours a day and I don't regret the Time that I'm I'm spending watching Netflix for three hours a day how how is He how can he possibly tell me that I Should be spending that time pursuing Goals instead right well again Acknowledging that goals can be I want To have a vegetable garden I want a Little walk more I want to spend time With friends I wanna I wanna tube down The river more often all of those things Right I think what I would tell those people Is that I had the unfortunate experience Of when I was 22. I I was robbed at Gunpoint you know head on the floor of a Restaurant gun to my head Uh a man counting back from three and Telling me when he hit zero he's going To shoot me in the head and I was absolutely Without any doubt sure that I was going To die that day and I believed I was in The last moments of my life And I will tell you that I did not feel Fear or sadness or anger the only Feeling I was consumed with was regret
I instantly understood that I was 22 Years old and I had failed to do Anything with my life that I had wanted To do that looking back on my life as Joyous as parts of it were many of it Many of my parts of my life were I realized how much time I had wasted And how I had not done anything And so for me that was a hinge point in My life now it resulted in 15 years of PTSD and a lot of problems but Ever since that day you know my Approach Is You know my 100 year old plan you know Which is what I would suggest to your Netflix person I enjoy watching Netflix Three hours a day to hell with him I Would say when you're a hundred will you Be happy Having lived this life the way you're Living it now the 100 year old version Of yourself who's lying on their Deathbed will that person look back and Go thank goodness you spent those days Watching killing Eve a television show That you have no recollection of anymore Right thank goodness that you watched All 22 seasons of Dexter because a life Without Dexter is a life unfulfilled my Suggestion would be the hundred year old Version of you is saying get off your Ass are you crazy You're watching something that is Meaningless to you and remember I am the
Person who supports the woman who wants To watch every the best 50 movies of all Time sitting next to her husband you Know enjoying a glass of wine I'm all For it but I think what happens is she Is taking a purposeful approach to a Dream And it has definition and meaning and I Think the 100 year old version of Herself will look back and go thank Goodness I watched the 50 greatest films Ever made on this planet and thank Goodness I spent that time with my Husband and thank goodness we talked About that meaningful art but when it Comes to Netflix or a phone I think what Most people do is they just follow the Path of which is at least resistance They're just watching for watching's Sake they're just filling their hours With things that are easy rather than Things that are hard and things that are Forgettable rather than things that are Memorable I don't think we remember most Of the television we watch and I don't Think we value it now I love television My son and I are making our way through Every season's every episode and every Um every season of The Simpsons he's 10. I love watching The Simpsons with my son And we crack up about it and we make Jokes about her for days later he still Walks around to make jokes he thought Aerosmith was a band that only existed
In The Simpsons one day it came on the Radio he goes hey these are the Simpsons Guys I'm like no no no these are guys Who were on The Simpsons right these are The moments this is Meaningful use of my Time watching a Netflix show right that Is important to me during the pandemic My wife my son and I went through every Single Marvel movie we had never watched One and we often talk about how that was A beautiful way to spend three months in Quarantine watching every Marvel movie We will always remember that as a joyous Time in our lives but I think most People don't approach the way that they Consume content like that I think they Are just thinking it's seven o'clock I've eaten my dinner Now I'm supposed to sit down for three Hours and watch a television show that I Will forget about and then I will go to Bed and then I'll repeat it the next day And when I'm 100 and I'm on my lying on My deathbed I will be thinking my God so Many more things I could have done right David Cassidy you know the musician I Just learned that uh he's The Partridge Family Guy and he became world famous David Cassidy is a world famous musician He died a couple years ago He was speaking to his daughter on his Deathbed the last thing he said to his Daughter and in his life was so much Wasted time
And that is a world-renowned musician Who Made music that made millions of people Happy and in the last moments of his Life he was thinking about all the time He wasted I think that's what your Netflix person is gonna It's what's gonna happen to the Netflix Person but I understand them if I was Asked to like today I just want to do Whatever makes me happy I'll eat a hot Dog I'll play golf I'll have sex right Those three things that's it that and I'll watch The Simpsons with Charlie and Every single day if I did that would Make me happy on that day but when I'm 100 I will look back and think what the Hell did you do You really spent every single day Playing golf eating hot dogs having sex And playing and watching The Simpsons With Charlie with all the other things You could have been doing in life you Couldn't have filled a few more days With a few more things I think that's What happens This episode is very kindly brought to You by wework now this is particularly Exciting for me because I have been a Full paying customer of wework for the Last two years now I discovered it During you know when the pandemic was in On the verge of being lifted and I spent Like the whole year just sort of sitting
In my room making YouTube videos but Then I discovered wework and I was a Member me and Angus my team members we Were members of the wework in Cambridge And they have like hundreds of other Locations worldwide as well and it was Incredible because we had this fantastic Beautifully designed office space to go To to work and we found ourselves like Every day just at nine o'clock in the Morning just going to wework because it Was a way nicer experience working from The co-working space than it was just Sitting at home working these days what Me and everyone in my team has is the All access pass which means you're not Tied to a specific wework location but It means you can use any of their Several hundred co-working spaces around London around the UK and also around the World and one of the things I really Love about the co-working setup is that It's fantastic as a bit of a change of Scenery so these days I work from home I've got the studio at home but if I Need to get some focused writing work Done and I've been I'm feeling a bit Drained just sitting at my desk all day I'll just pop over to the local wework Which is about a 10 minute walk from Where I am I'll take my laptop up with Me I've got some free coffee from there I'll get a few snacks and it's just such A great Vibe and you get to meet cool
People I made a few friends through Meeting them at wework and it's just Really nice being an environment almost Like a library but kind of nicer because There's like a little bit of soft music In the background and there's other kind Of startup Bros and creators and stuff In in there as well and it's just my Absolute favorite co-working space of All time it's super easy to book a desk Or book a conference room using the app And it's a great place to meet up with Team members if you're going to Collaborate and you'll live in different Places they've got unlimited tea and Coffee and herbal teas and drinks on tap And they've also got various kind of After work events that happen like happy Hours and yoga and a few other exercise Type things and you can also take in Guests so often when guests will come Over to visit I'll say hey let's pop Into wework and we'll just work from There for the whole day and then we'll Go out for dinner sometime in the Evening anyway if you're looking for a Co-working space for you or your team Then I'd 100 recommend wework like I Said I've been a pain customer for Theirs for the last two years which is Why it's particularly exciting that They're now sponsoring this episode and If you want to get 50 off your first Booking then do head over to we.com
Forward slash Ali and you can use the Coupon code Ali at checkout Ali to get 50 of your first booking so thank you so Much wework for sponsoring this episode There's a there's a great story that you Tell in your new book some days today Um about Um think you had a lunch with someone And they were a few minutes late like Seven minutes late or something I wonder If you can you can tell that story Because that's that's one that's really Really stuck with me so I always am Willing to give fledgling writers 30 Minutes of my time if they will meet me In the place that I happen to be and I Was in McDonald's that day which is Actually one of my favorite places to Meet writers at some I like the sort of Tearing away of all of what people see As writing which is you know I need to Be at a coffee shop with smooth jazz and A cappuccino I like to put them in a Plastic table With a lot of noise and and Diet Coke so She met me at the McDonald's and she was Late and so when she sat down I said Tell me what's your plan what you're Doing and she started describing this Book you know and it sounded interesting Like I was like this sounds like a good Project but I just waited for my moment And then eventually I said as I always Say to writers I say so how much have
You written and so often almost always The answer is oh well I haven't started Writing anything yet And I then I said to her I said well you Were seven minutes late today and she Said I'm sorry you know she bet I'm so Sorry I'm like no no my point was not That you were seven minutes late and I Was upset my point was I used the seven Minutes that you were late to write some Sentences you know I turned my computer I said this is what I wrote in the seven Minutes that you were late right she was A person who believed she could only Write in a two-hour block that her ideal Writing time was like 10 to 12 you know That she needed to be in a certain place In a certain mind frame which is so Often every creative person's belief That they only work under certain Circumstances ideally so I reminded her That during World War One there were men In trenches wearing gas masks artillery Exploding over their heads and they were Scribbling in little books in journals Hoping that if they survived this battle And the many battles that were to come Someday they might publish something so Thank goodness that the writers of the 1910s did not require Starbucks Smooth jazz and two-hour quiet blocks of Time for them to get their work done Because that's just not a reality Especially if you actually want to make
A thing if you want to do something like A vegetable garden in your backyard or Write a book or create a YouTube channel If you actually want to do it you should Want to be doing it whenever it's Possible so I I tell all of the creative People of the world 10 minutes is Precious to you it doesn't mean in 10 Minutes I can write a chapter But you know in 10 minutes I can re-read The last three paragraphs I wrote Earlier today and see if they're okay And clean them up a little bit or I can Write five good new sentences so It's just the idea that People they just assume they need these Ideal situations in order to create Something lovely you know whereas like Van Gogh Was like mentally unstable and Unmedicated and produced some of the Greatest work in the world you know but Had he been living in 2022 people might Have said well let's get control of some Of your mental illness first let's Experiment with some medication before We get you painting right like it's Always this idea that everything has to Be right before we launch and that's not True we should just launch we launch now We're not the Space Program we're not Putting people into orbit where we have To be careful we just have to take steps Forward and as is the case with most
People she really wasn't invested in Writing she was invested in the idea of Having written or in the idea that I can Quit my job and write from 10 to 12 Every day and then have lunch with my Friends and that is the writer's life Which is as you well know not the Writer's life Nice Um yeah I I think back to that bit of Your book whenever I feel like oh you Know I should you know I should probably Do some book stuff right now but yeah I've only got 23 minutes until you know Until this thing that I have to do and Like oh you know I could go down I could Get a coffee get a biscuit just like Lounge around a bit I can't get anything Done in 23 minutes I need I need hours And hours you know with my with my flat Whites in my hand and like my Lord of The Rings in my background music to get Into the Zone uh but I love the way you Put that of like in the seven minutes I Wrote some sentences I'm just thinking That if I I should just have that Approach because like when I was you Know when I was when I was working as a Doctor Um and trying to do the YouTube thing on The side I would use those seven minutes Blocks of time here and there to write Stuff for videos like if I'd be on the Toilet instead of scrolling Twitter on
My phone I'd be on notion typing out Some stuff for a video or if I'm waiting Eight minutes for a patient's blood Results to arrive and there's no one Else in the waiting room and there's Nothing for me to do it's like great Let's open up notion on the Windows Computers in front of me and just like Type out a few notes for a video and so Many people in my in my Academy ask like Oh but like I've got I've got a job like How do you do YouTube alongside the job I'm always like like man like there are Very few jobs where you don't have small Small amounts of time here and there Where you normally you normally waste Scrolling on your phone where if you Wanted to and if you really cared about This thing I'm not saying you have to But if you did you could potentially Spend that time opening up Apple notes And just drafting a few bullet points For for your next video and I think I've Got that approach to YouTube but I Really don't have the approach to the Book because for the book I've commit I've talked myself into believing the that like I need to I need to Have four hours and like the appropriate Coffee cup and all that crap yeah well I Wrote my fifth novel almost all of it in Faculty meetings while teaching now Admittedly it's a book of lists it's a Novel written by an obsessive list maker
So the book is told or the story is told Through list after list after list after List but I wrote almost most all of Those lists in those moments of a Faculty meeting when something was being Said that was irrelevant to me which was An enormous number of minutes in those Faculty meetings or I always arrive five Minutes early and I use those five Minutes and as things are wrapping up or We have a raffle at the end of it Because that's going to make us happy I'd just be writing lists and the beauty Of that was I didn't even need to write On a computer I could have a Post-It Note that I'm writing a list on and that Can later be transferred into the Computer I wrote a whole book during Meetings and you know I always remind People a book is probably about five Thousand sentences so like Incrementalism right pile up 5 000 Sentences and you have a book I can't Guarantee that's going to be a good book That depends on you and your effort and Skill and experience but it's five Thousand sentences and if I write seven Sentences here I am a lot closer to five Thousand than I was a minute ago I Really believe that that seven sentence Step forward is a significant one Especially because I know I'll do that 23 times today I'll take 23 moments in My day to write somewhere between 1 and
50 sentences and if I just keep doing That you know that is why I Have a pile of books you know it's it And you know I'm a school teacher you Know I am a wedding DJ I have a Consulting business I'm launching Another business I do I'm a minister I Officiate weddings I'm a substitute Minister at churches even though I Really don't have a lot of faith in God I do all these things and people the Reason I wrote my book was because People would ask me how do you do all That you do and I would always say well If you give me 12 hours I'll sit down With you and I'll go through your whole Life and I'll help you out and no one Wants to do that so the book was the Answer to that question Um but yeah same thing with writing is With everything else people get very Precious Over how a creative person works or how Creativity Works whether that creativity Is writing a book painting a painting or Figuring out how are you gonna you know Lay out your vegetable garden or my son Right he's official he's taking up Fishing this summer he loves it he's Obsessed with fishing and you know he Had his tackle box and he bought all This gear and I said all right when are You gonna set it up and he said right Now and I said well you got to go to bed
In 10 minutes and he goes I can get some Of it done in 10 minutes Dad and I was Like damn he is right like I was gonna Tell him don't start setting up your Tackle box now wait for the morning but He was like no I'll get some of it done I got 10 minutes before you're gonna Make me brush my teeth that's exactly The attitude you have to have Nice love it Um so just uh I one of the things that Also struck me about the book was it Seems you have a pretty Cavalier Attitude towards rules and I wonder if You can just talk about your attitude Towards rules yeah well I think rule Followers tend to be the least Productive people in the world you know I think that Well it happened to me last night I was With my friend Jenny And uh she was telling me about how she Had made a mistake in her classroom as a Teacher and she got in trouble she said I got in trouble with my principal and I Said what was trouble and she said well I got yelled at and I said did he Actually raise his voice and she said Well no he told me what I did wrong I said so you received feedback from Your boss on your performance So we have to pull back trouble And yelling to feedback from your boss On how to fix your performance for next
Time which is a normal thing that Happens in a workplace every day But so often Jenny's a rule follower so Often rule followers see the violation Of a rule as a potentially dangerous Thing that will result in a catastrophe Catastrophic series of events that will Destroy their lives when most of the Time none of the rules actually matter Most of them are made up arbitrarily and Most of them are relevant so you know I'm not proposing people Rob or you know Commit crimes in any way but what I'm Proposing is Test the world in terms of rules you Know one of my favorite tests I don't Know if I wrote about this in the book Is every time I do extra work as a Teacher I have to fill out a timesheet Actually in almost everything I have to Do as a teacher I have to fill out like A list of things to the top a heading And one of them is my name and then it Always says position I think I'm supposed to write teacher up There but I always write the word Upright my position is upright I've done That for 24 years and no one has ever Said anything to me about writing the Word upright which is a signal to me That that question is irrelevant now It's sort of a rule that I'm supposed to Indicate my position on these forms but By writing upright I have discovered
That that is an irrelevant rule that That is something no one has ever looked At and no one has ever cared when I do And so I take that approach to most of My life which is let me see what happens If I don't do this thing because almost Always what will happen is someone will Say you need to do that thing and I say Oh my gosh you're right I'll do it next Time and then I know it has to be done But I will tell you that Half of the time and every Administrative task I am required to do At work half the time when I don't do it Nobody ever says a word to me and it Does not affect my job in any way There's just layers upon layers of rules In our world The parking lot at my uh we have we Belong to this Lake Club There's a parking lot and I invent Parking spots which make my children Crazy because they're real followers but I just parked on the grass next to the Parking lot because all the parking Spaces are filled and I don't want to Have to go to the auxiliary parking lot Which is far away and they go Dad this Isn't a parking spot I said I know it's Not but who's in charge here at the lake Club it's not the police right and they Don't tick it because there's no like Meter made here at the at the lake Club The worst thing that's going to happen
Is a teenage lifeguard is going to come Over to me and say Excuse me sir you Can't park there and then I will say oh I'm sorry I'll go park it somewhere else Now I've been doing this for four years No one has ever said a word to me I make Parking spots up because I recognize That there's no official in charge of Any parking lot anywhere on the planet You can basically Park wherever you want And unless you're like on a college Campus and maybe there's a Security even Then do they have a tow truck are they Going to tow you for parking in the Wrong place at the University at best You're going to get a note maybe a Ticket most of the time I'm at a University that I'm never coming back to Thank you for your ticket good luck Getting paid on that one right which is Another rule that I won't follow but the Problem is is when we follow all these Rules when we obsess When we obsessing the expectations of Others that are unnecessary we lose time So I encourage people to just sort of Cut every corner you can because your Life and your time are too precious to Be absorbed with bureaucracy that is Utterly unnecessary Have you have you always had this Attitude like oh can you trace it back To like a moment where you realize that This was a thing
The moment I can trace it back this is Crazy but it's really true I'm in Kindergarten in Mrs Dubois class and I Am building a tower of blocks during Indoor recess And she Rings her a little about she Says recess is over and I still have a Few blocks to put on the tower And uh she says Matt you know clean it Up and I said Yup just one sec I had to Finish the tower And you know I'm a kindergartner so I Guess I'm taking a long time Matt clean It up I'm like yeah yeah I'm gonna get To it and so she comes over and she Slides her foot under the tower so that It collapses in front of me And I'm so mad about it I say something I don't know what I say but it's bad Enough to get me in trouble and the Trouble is go to the corner which was a Kindergarten punishment which is you go Stand in the corner with your nose in The corner and I was terrified of it Because only Sean trudell got sent to The corner like the red-headed demon and Now I'm going to the corner And I remember I went and I stood in the Corner underneath a flag and there was a Pencil sharpener and I stood in the Corner and I said to myself It's just a corner Like this is nothing Why was I afraid of the corner
Put me in the corner all day lady if I Can do what I want and I suddenly Understood that all I will ever have to Do in life at worst is trade choice for Time which is what I did in high school All the time you know I would I would Just do what I wanted with the Acknowledgment that at the end of the Day I would have to spend an hour in Detention where I would just do my Homework which I would be doing at home Anyway you know so like there was a Beyond the school there was a stream and Beyond The Stream there was a forest and We were not allowed to go across the Stream into the forest one day I was Like well I'm gonna go in the forest Because I want to know what's there and I'm just going to trade time I'm just Going to trade time to go explode the Forest which is exactly what I did I Went to the forest I the bell rang I ran I jumped the stream I almost didn't get In trouble like the teacher caught me at The very end she's like did you just Jump the stream and I'm always honest I Believe in like be honest don't lie I Said yeah I went to the forest she said You can't go to the forest I said I know So why'd you go to the forest I said Well I wanted to see what was in the Forest she goes you're not allowed to go To the forest I said I know y'all give Me detention and I'll go do the
Detention but now I know what's in the Forest and she lost her mind because She's a rule follower she can't Understand that whole notion of trading Choice for time and that's essentially At worst what will ever happen when you Break a rule but most of the time Nothing happens except you go oh I'm Sorry I'll fix that and then you fix it But remember my friend Jenny Saw Feedback from a boss as trouble and Yelling when neither one was actually True she did not get in trouble it was No actual consequence and he did not Raise his voice but in most people's Minds that's what happens when they get Called into their boss's office and the Boss says hey you didn't fill out that Form you didn't complete the data in That database and you go oh my gosh I'm So sorry I'll go do it right now that Won't happen again they'll even think I Just got in trouble you didn't get in Trouble the boss has already forgotten About you they just need the database Done right don't do it again now maybe Trouble will happen but test the world Find where the pain points are most of Them don't exist you think there are Pain points when really there's parking Everywhere just take advantage of it Yeah I think I was very much a real Follower when I was younger because I
Was very wedded to the idea of being the Good kid Um and I kind of admire my brother when He when he was younger because when we When we were younger because he was very Much not a rule follower and would Always do things and I'd be like oh but Like that's against the rules he's not And he'd be like I don't care I'm gonna Do it anyway And then and then as I as I growled Around especially once I I got to University and started working like you Know Cambridge University is meant to be This fancy big ass name University and Like the admin and the organization and Stuff was pretty non-existent in the Medical school and still is to the to This day and so we'd end up on these Random placements in random hospitals in The middle of nowhere where no one has Any idea that we're supposed to be there Even though they're technically the ones In charge of our placement right I Remember there was one time where Um my mum was invited to the Caribbean To give a talk at some conference and She had a plus one and she said Gee Would you want to come along and it was Bang in the middle of my general surgery Placement I was like you know what let's Let's yeah why not I'll I'll figure Something out my mum is a rule follower So I didn't tell her that I wasn't
Actually allowed to take time off but You know I went to the Caribbean for a Week had a great time came back and I Remember being like really terrified Because the following day was going to Be our end of placement meeting with the Head general surgeon and she was going To be like you know I've spoken to all The colleagues we didn't see you on These dates Etc and so I was like preparing all These like reasons in my head and sort Of yeah it's fine I'll do another two Weeks of the placement if you want me to Et cetera et cetera and she came in and She was like guys I'm so sorry I haven't Been around very much I've just been so Busy with like you know the patience and Like this and that I'm so sorry I Haven't been giving you the time you Deserve I was just like oh my god Um everyone is making it up as they go Along and no one has it together and a Lot of these arbitrary rules and Expectations for things uh are just that Arbitrary and now my thought process if I want to do something is like what's What's the worst that's actually going To happen yeah and if it's just like I Don't know a parking ticket or Equivalent or a telling off whatever That looks what else who cares if I want To do the thing they'll do the thing and
I feel like that's been a really useful Kind of life life hack yeah what you Just said was so important everyone is Making up everything it's weird that Some people feel like there's sort of an Archetypal Structured you know set of codified Rules so you just have to get married And like you know discover that your Spouse thinks spoon should be separated Because that's a rule that she had when She was a child and you didn't have that Rule and suddenly you discover that oh Some people think there is an actual Proper way to do something when really We just made up the proper way and you Can just make up a new proper way but That is how they live their lives my Wife is starting a new program a new Educational program she's going to learn To teach on children of who speak other Languages Esau program and she said you Know they seem really disorganized I'm Worried and I said no be excited when You're in a program full of disorganized People that means there's cracks to Exploit like if they can't keep track of Their own stuff they will not be able to Keep track of you in the way they should And that means you will be able to take Advantage of that I love being in a Situation where clearly the person on Top doesn't know what they're doing Because as soon as that happens you just
Know that you can start taking advantage Of this rule breaking I'm going to take Care of myself attitude she's still Nervous about it because she's a rule Follower she wants to be in a world Where there's clearly stated rules I Want to be in a role where there's Clearly stated entirely flexible and Oftentimes avoidable rules and you know And people who who can't enforce those Things so I love disorganization I know That I can thrive because I can take Advantage of it Nice Um I'd love to talk a little bit about Storytelling but before we go there um Can you elaborate on what happened in Your gun situation because I imagine a Lot of people are like whoa you Gotta come to your head you thought You're gonna die like what's the like You're still here so what's what's going On yeah I used to not be able to talk About it you know it was years of Therapy that allowed me to I was Managing a McDonald's restaurant uh in Brockton Massachusetts real tough town And uh it was after closing the store Was closed up and I was at the safe Counting money And Um I Heard the windows break and I knew Someone was coming and I knew that I was in trouble because the
Police had come the week before and Warned me that there were people uh Robbing restaurants and two people had Already been killed including someone Like in the Taco Bell that I could see Across the across the way they had Killed somebody there so when I heard The glass break I knew I was in trouble And for reasons I'll never understand I Had seven thousand dollars in my hand And the deposit that was to go to the Bank the next morning And I dropped it down the slot in the Back of the safe the one that dropped The money into a box that I could not Open and it sat on the box manager has No key And so when they got to the office and They put me on the ground with my Employees and they started emptying the Safe they knew right away that there Wasn't enough money here that like There's money in the drawers there's Some change but where is the receipts From the night and I said it's in that Box I can't open it and they didn't Believe me or they wanted to test Whether I really could open it or not so They beat me first And then um when that didn't work and I Still couldn't open the box uh one of Them put me on the ground and pressed my Head to the greasy tile floor and then Put the gun to my head and pressed my
Head onto the floor with the gun and he Said I'm going to count back from three You need to open that box because if I Get down to zero I'm gonna shoot you in The head And I it was a terrible moment for me But oddly this hinge point because I Felt all this regret thinking I was Going to die and he pulled the trigger On an empty gun so it clicked and then Um and then like it's hard to describe But I sort of like I almost became an Animal I tried to crawl away I could Barely breathe they pulled me back and They did it to me two more times where They counted back and each time they Said this is the real time like we Killed people already we're gonna kill You so but each time despite the fact That I was sort of each time more losing My mind than the last time I was so consumed with regret in those Moments and ultimately they pulled the Trigger on an empty gun three times and Then left Um I guess I convinced them after the Third time that he really can't get this Box open so there's no point in killing Him whereas like the guy in Taco Bell Had resisted and that's why he died I Wasn't resisting I was just unable to Open that open the box with the money in It Yeah so you know it took a long time I
Fortunately met my wife I didn't Understand therapy you know so for years I would just not be able to tell that Story hear the clicking of a gun in the Middle of the day wake up in the middle Of the night screaming every night with A nightmare and then eventually I met my Wife and She said what's going on and I said well You know I have nightmares at night I Said you know how some people play Tennis and some people collect stamps This is my thing and she's like that's Not a thing like what's going on with You is not a thing so it took a long Time PTSD is a difficult thing to deal With and it's still to this day I still Have moments but but I'm much much Better now and You know I would never ever wish it on Anyone my goal always in life is I don't Ever want that to happen to anyone but What I do want is please listen to what I learned in that singular moment like It was an odd blessing to truly believe You're at the end of your life I've Worked with a couple other people Actually who have worked with me who Knew near-death survivors like me now Mine wasn't a near death it turns out Because the gun was empty but I believed I was going to die and I'll never forget I was having dinner in a diner one night With one of these guys and he says I
Know three of you three people who are At the end of their life and Miraculously managed to survive he said All three of you are the same they're You're all the same in your approach to Life you're all the same on your like Let's make sure this this moment counts You know you're all the same on like Something bad is happening but at least It's memorable you know my wife and I And my kids got caught in a lightning Storm in New York last week while we Were touring the Intrepid we left at the Wrong moment we're under a bridge in a Lightning storm there's a pipe pouring Water out on us you know you know it all The Ubers are canceling us and I said You know what we're never going to Forget this you know and my wife was Like I know you believe that but can we Get out of this situation and I'm like I'm trying to get us out but let's just All acknowledge that we're so lucky to Be having a moment that we'll never Forget because so many moments in our Lives are utterly forgettable at least We're having a memorable one and um That's the approach that people have who Have sort of faced the end and managed To you know take a step back so I want People to just learn from it without Having to experience it Yeah thank you thank you so much for Sharing um my understanding is that this
Is not the only near-death experience You've had and you've actually been like Brought back from from the grave um well What what was the deal with that right So twice in my life oddly I have stopped Breathing my heart has stopped beating And paramedics have restored my life Through CPR uh when I was 12 I was stung By a bee not knowing that I'm allergic You know back in the time when nobody Was allergic to anything and I found Myself in my house alone Having an allergic reaction to the bee Sting I didn't even know I didn't know What was happening because I had been Stung by bees before and never had a Reaction it was a particular B and um I Actually I oddly called my mother who Was in the hospital having back surgery At the time it was in the times when you Could actually have a direct line to a Hospital room so I called her room and Said my I can't breathe and she didn't Know what was happening but she said Call 9-1-1 but it was also in a time When phones were connected to the wall By a cord and that I was on the floor on The phone and I couldn't stand up to Hang the phone up to get a dial tone to Call 9-1-1 you couldn't disconnect Unless you hung the phone up back then And so my mother had the woman in the Bed next to her call 9-1-1 for her and Send the ambulance to my house and my
Mother heard me Go unconscious heard the paramedics they Had to break the door down because for Some reason I had locked the door when I Came in she heard the paramedics saying Like he's not breathing I don't have a Pulse she listened to the CPR they Didn't know she was on the phone like Screaming Um but they managed to get me back and Then um And then five years later I was 17 I was In a head-on collision I went through The windshield of a car got hung up Halfway through and Um again on the way to the hospital in The back of an ambulance I stopped Breathing my heart stopped beating and Uh paramedics ucpr again to restore my Life the difference though I know it Sounds crazy The difference is that in both of those Circumstances as traumatic and horrible As they were I didn't think I was dying Either time Like in the bee sting I closed my like I Went unconscious but I wasn't thinking I'm going to die I thought something's Wrong with me and that everything went Black And I go through the windshield I'm Conscious completely I'm in shock Thankfully because I don't want to Describe the injuries but they're
Horrific Uh but I managed to pull my head out of A windshield and climb out of a car and I'm just I am destroyed I wasn't wearing A seat belt I was 17 and stupid and uh But I'm in the back of an ambulance I'm I'm they're getting ready to move me to The ambulance the snow's falling because It's a snowy day and I remember the snow Was falling in my eyes and I closed my Eyes And the next moment I'm in the back of An ambulance is a woman straddling my Waist pounding on my chest and some guys Trying to force a tube down my throat And I'm coughing it up I didn't know I was gonna die either So I can retrospectively look back and Go oh my God I almost died twice But I didn't feel any regret because I Didn't know at the moment that I was Dying so even though those moments Should have been wake up calls to me They were not because I didn't Understand the perilous situation I was In it wasn't until I was 22 and faced With a moment where I actually thought I Was going to die that I had that Understanding about what it means to not Have to not have done what you wanted to Do so um it's odd now my therapist will Say those other two moments probably Really primed you For the for the moment with the gun and
And the exceptionally difficult case of PTSD that I had was probably the result Of the gun but also Going through a windshield and being Stung by a bee and all of that stuff That came after that he you know he Pointed out probably rightfully so that You were well primed for a terrible case Of PTSD when that guy put the gun to Your head so But they didn't change my life I did not Change my life at 12 and I did not Change my life at 17. I did not change My life until I was 22. So what did you start doing from 22 Onwards like what I guess you had this Realization that ah I you know life Filled with regret what what happened Next Well I had just stopped being homeless When I got the job you know I was Homeless for a period of time I I was Arrested for a crime I did not commit And when I got arrested I was jailed and Then released on my recognizance but I Immediately lost my job and then I lost My home for a bunch of reasons and I Didn't have any parents my parents threw Me out when I was 18 and I was on my own For the rest of my life so I was Homeless for a period of my life and Then some people who I knew former Employees at a McDonald's that I managed Found out I was homeless and rescued me
Took me into their house and back in the 90s you couldn't get a job unless you Had a phone and you couldn't have a Phone unless you had a wall to put the Phone on because no phones were mobile Back then so once I was living with Mary And Jerry I was sharing a room with Their goat they had an indoor goat and I Shared the room with the goat a little Pantry that they converted to a bedroom For me with the goat once I had the Phone though I could get a job and so You know I had to get jobs because I had To pay for an attorney because the Courts wouldn't provide me with one for Lots of reasons that are stupid and so I Was working 85 hours a week at two jobs I was working actually for a bank oddly Even though I was on trial for Grand Larceny and I was closing that McDonald's at night I know it's crazy I Actually in the trial the bank I go to Work for is the bank where I was Supposed to drop a deposit for McDonald's the one that goes missing That I've arrested for so I'm actually Working for the bank that testifies Against me in the trial and I'm working For McDonald's even though McDonald's Also testifies against me in the trial So it's quite a story but eventually you Know after the robbery I have to get Myself out of this legal trouble so I'm Already working 85 hours a week but four
Months after the robbery I'm declared Um not guilty And so I'm free to do what I want to do And I immediately for the first time in My life I go to college I go to a Community college because they'll allow Me in for free because I'm completely Poor And I start um I take classes I join the Debate team I start writing for the Newspaper I'm working at a McDonald's Restaurant again now I'm managing McDonald's 50 hours a week while I'm Going to school full time and working For the newspaper and I'm on the debate Team I become the president of the National Honor Society there and I get Involved in student government people Ask me like how did you do all that and Work 50 hours a week and I say after You're homeless and in jail and you have A gun to your head and you think you're Going to be in prison for 10 years Nothing else is hard I was just so Excited to be taking a step forward and So I got my job at McDonald's and I went To college and then I graduated from MCC This community college and I did well Enough that Yale and Trinity College and A bunch of very well respected Universities offered me free rides to Their schools and so um I ultimately I Went to Trinity College in Hartford Connecticut to get an English degree
And there's this there's a situation Here in Hartford where you can take a Class at another school a Consortium of Schools exists so I knew I wanted to be A teacher and a writer but Trinity Didn't have a teaching program so I did My English degree there and then through This Consortium I went to an all women's College Like a one town over to get a teaching Degree and I went over there and they Said well first it's an all women's College and I said I know but through The Consortium I am allowed to take a Class here right and they said yes Technically you can they said but why do You want to take five classes I said Well I want to do a teaching program Here and they said no the Consortium is Really just so if you can't get a class At your home school you could get it Here if it doesn't fit your schedule I said But can I take five classes through the Consortium there's nothing again rule Following right there's nothing here in This book that says I can't take as many Classes as I want through your Consortium And she said so you're going to take Eight classes this semester you're going To take five education classes with us And three English classes of Trinity and I said yes and she said nobody does that
And I said well I'm going to do it she Says that's like a loophole that you're Exploiting and I said yes now you Understand and so that's what I did I Went to two colleges simultaneously Through the loophole so that by the time I graduated I had an English degree and A teaching degree simultaneously and but All of it people and I was also working Full-time at McDonald's and part-time at A Writing Center and I was launching my DJ business at the time and I part of me Thinks how did I actually do that like It really does seem a little impossible But I always say to myself I was Homeless I was facing prism I was you know I was hopeless and all You have to do is take someone who's Hopeless and give them a little hope and Nothing seems as hard anymore so that's How I eventually got to where I wanted To be Um but you can see how my life Instantaneously changed I was not going To suffer regret anymore I was going to Maximize every moment I had to get to Where I wanted to be as quickly as Possible That's incredible incredible stuff like Um for for people who are listening who Like we we glossed over a bunch of you Know like arrested for a crime I didn't Commit like the bank robbery situation The second first time around et cetera
Etc Um a lot of these stories are in story Worthy and a few a few of them are in The new book as well so this is a nice Little teaser that if you want to uh Hear more of Matthew on Audible or read More of Matthew in print or on Kindle Then by all means uh check these books Out because because they're amazing Thank you I always I'll just add I just I never want people to think I'm sort of Special in some way you know sometimes People hear that story and they're like My God that guy and you know if my wife Was here she'd be like he's not that Special like you know he works really Hard and he's got this weird perception Of life that admittedly has allowed him To do all these things like he sees the World in a way that is different than Other people only because You know because of moments in my life But I always want people to know that Like I really believe everyone can do That my wife at our book launch someone Said what's Matt's best quality and she Said it is his genuine belief that every Single person in the world can do what He's doing if they apply themselves and I do I believe that every person can do What I just described I think you could Work 50 hours a week and get two degree Programs and and work for the newspaper And dual is launch a business I believe
Everyone could do it I'm not sure if you Should or if you should even want to Right and you probably don't need to you Probably aren't homeless facing prison No parents to ever help you no safety Net of any kind like I had to do it Because of my life circumstances but it Doesn't mean you couldn't and if you Believe that you could do it then Imagine all the other things you could Be doing instead I just I I never want People to think that I'm special in some Way because truly I'm not I'm a really Average guy I'm an ordinary guy who's Applied himself You know relentlessly to making sure he Gets the things that's done that he Wants to get done and you can do that Too Yeah I'm just kind of thinking of uh I Was speaking to a friend the other day Who has has these dreams like she wants To launch a YouTube channel she wants to Like have her own freelance business etc Etc and you know we were kind of talking Through it I was like all right cool so You know what what are you doing this Evening and she was like oh you know Like from you know I'll probably get Home from work at like 7 p.m and then You know it takes an hour to cook food And okay cool then what do you think From eight it's like oh yeah and then I Need about two hours to wind down for
The evening because I find that it's Like you know I find that Um yeah in the evening I can't really Concentrate and I just find that Watching TV helps me helps me helped me Really wind down I was like okay cool And then then she was like oh yeah and Then I sleep at 10 because I need to get My eight hours of sleep and then I wake Up at six and then I go to work and and I kind of do this thing And I was like okay um I mean sure That's that's fine if that's all if you Wanna you wanna go for but like do you Do you really need those two hours of Wind down time every night she was like Oh yeah yeah you know any you know I've I've got to have those two hours because Then I can't like function if I don't Have those two hours I was like okay you Know part of me was very skeptical about Um Another Part Of Me was like I mean I Don't want to deny her lived experience And then maybe she's got stuff going on That I don't know anything about But then I was thinking like when you Have people who are in a desperate Situation Like you know uh single parents raising Kids and working two jobs to make ends Meet and stuff Those people are not the ones Complaining that they need two hours of
Downtime for their mental health and for Their uh whatever and and there's this Yeah I'm I'm never really sure how to Respond to that Beyond okay fair enough You know if that's what you want to do Then that's totally fine because I don't Want to get into the territory of like No you're actually wasting those two Hours and actually you could do the Thing because Everyone has problems I've done anything About yeah is is is that something that Kind of Vibes with you at all yeah Here's what I would have told her Because I get this all the time yeah I Would have said You need two hours of downtime but is it Possible only one Can we try one hour of downtime and one Hour of productivity right so we start With that so you're not taking away Everything that she needs but you're Suggesting that perhaps you don't need As much as you do right so let's try That for a little while you also Mentioned that you need eight hours in Bed every night so admit instantly I'd Analyze her sleep I'd be like well Describe your sleep to me which I'm sure Is by the way not eight hours of sleep I Am sure she gets into bed there might be A TV in the room there is a phone in her Hand there's a book being read uh she Probably doesn't meditate she probably
Doesn't have white noise she probably Doesn't have a consistent sleep cycle on The weekends which is screwing up her Ability to fall asleep quickly she's Probably using a snooze button in the Morning she's probably lounging in bed The eight hours of sleep is probably Seven hours of sleep and one hour of Occupying the bed in a non-productive Way right so can we take away maybe an Hour of sleep which is not really I'm Taking away an hour of bedtime not sleep Time like can we recapture two hours Because two hours just do the math for Her two hours every day over the course Of a year is an enormous amount of time And you will accomplish many many things I had a friend named Erica who came to Me and said Matt I have my third kid now And I've lost all the time for myself And I know you always find time for Yourself you play a lot of golf and Poker and back like and you do all these Things how do you do it and I said the First thing I want you to try Erica is I Just want you to sleep one hour less I Want you to she used to get up at six I Said get up at five just get up at five And and also use from five to six to do All the things you want to do which for Her was exercise she had lost her Ability to exercise and eat well use From five to six to exercise and get Your meals ready so that you can eat
Well for the day and I said and if it Doesn't work because you genuinely need That extra hour of sleep go right back To it but I just think that we we Establish these habits and we assume They are a must rule followers right she Is a rule follower she is I need two Hours to to wind down could it be 90 Minutes Could it be 60 Minutes could it be 30 Minutes right and the same thing with The sleep so I would do that with her And I would look to recapture an hour or Two hours because an hour even over the Course of a year is 365 hours divide That by 24 you suddenly found days of Your life that you can now do use to to Do what you want to do but I think People get trapped in the And that sort of rule-making Habit-forming belief that this is the Way they must live because change is Hard because you know as I've been Telling people on this book tour I believe most human beings follow the Path of least resistance they are Watered down the mountain they are doing What people tell them to do what the Universe tells them to do and what some Weird Version of themselves in their head is Telling them what to do and I think that The hard thing and the right thing or The same thing and that the most
Successful people in the world are the Ones who do not follow the path of Resistance they pick the point on the Horizon that they want to aim at and Regardless of what is in front of them That is the pursuit that they have I Think most people don't do that Matthew thank you so much there's been a A fantastic conversation we were in I Was intending to talk to you about Storytelling but as usual we have gone You know And yeah it would be great to have a pot Too possibly in person when I come to The US or if you're ever in London would Be great to do this in personally we can Riff on storytelling on homework for Life and all the different things and That'd be amazing so much more to talk About yeah um and for anyone who's left This conversation wanting more Definitely check out um well the two Non-fiction books of yours that I've Read story worthy and someday is today And you also have these six novels which I need to read at some point The non-fiction stuff is the stuff where I like even even within them even within Those you have like these incredible Stories that often move me to tears and Everyone every single person I've ever Recommended story worthy to at least Because that's the one I read two years Ago has been like oh my God this book is
Sick so yeah I just want to say massive Thank you too thank you all that all That you do all that you put out into The world Um where can people learn more about you Where can people find out about your Stuff if they want to if they want to Reach out I have to just go to Matthewdx.com they can find everything Right there all right so that's it for This week's episode of Deep dive thank You so much for watching or listening All the links and resources that we Mentioned in the podcast are going to be Linked down in the video description or In the show notes depending on where You're watching or listening to this if You're listening to this on a podcast Platform then do please leave us a Review on the iTunes Store it really Helps other people discover the podcast Or if you're watching this in full HD or 4k on YouTube then you can leave a Comment down below and ask any questions Or any insights or any thoughts about The episode that would be awesome and if You enjoyed this episode you might like To check out this episode here as well Which links in with some of the stuff That we talked about in the episode so Thanks for watching uh do hit the Subscribe button if you aren't already And I'll see you next time bye
