“They Were WRONG!” – Neil deGrasse Tyson In Heated Vaccine Debate With Patrick Bet-David

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In this short clip, Patrick Bet-David, Neil Tyson and Adam Sosnick talk about whether people should be forced to take the vaccine.

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From what we knew at the beginning of Covet to what we know today what do we Know about the vaccine today that we Didn't know while we were all testing it In America taking it what have we Learned now what do you mean testing it On America they were attached before it Was released nine months is not a long Time to tell but it was tested yeah the Name of the average is 30 the average is Five to ten years I mean nine months is Not enough so you have to success no you Have to ask hold on it was tested on in Trials okay by the way I'm not claiming To be the expert on all this I read all The same things you have but I'm a Scientist so I read it as a scientist Okay there were trials that's what the Point of phase one two three trials are All about They are tested enough to get data on How to then advise the larger population Yes it was tested if you just say it Wasn't tested is it is a gap between Your awareness and understanding how Things work and what actually happened It was tested if you wanted to be tested On millions of people instead of Thousands you can put in for that you Can say I don't want this unless it's Millions that's okay totally fine with Me okay I'm okay with that but but so so Based on that do you say let's keep Testing it

While this virus keeps spreading okay Right so this is this is the contest Between the information you have Available to you at that moment and What's going on outside the lab People are dying hospitals are becoming Overloaded So Do you say we have good data on the Thousand it's not yet at a million in Case you wanted a million are you going To say let's still do it on another Let's wait another six months so we get Another million in here will you do that As a public health professional no I I Would have said allow the individual to Still have a choice that's okay with a Thousand instead of a few million leave The person have the choice not force Them to take it or else you're going to Get out of the Marines and you've been Doing this for 14 years not force them To take it or else you have to quit your Job it's a nurse there's a public health Force versus there's a choice no Um there's a public health contract That you have signed Implicitly as a citizen of A country where in part we depend on Each other For health our wealth our security and The like and that contract is In the best scientific evidence Available at the time

If you do not get vaccinated you will Put other people in this organization at Risk and that organization does not want To take that risk so you do not have This job anymore if you decline it So In with any public health decision There has to be a consequence to you not Participating in that social contract is It your job in some cases it was But no we're not going to have the Army Bust into your home and force a needle Into your shoulder That's not going to happen we pretty Much did that well only put your job at Risk yes yes 67 of Americans took to Covet that's Force that's not a choice That's a that's a lot of force and and Course again pushing going on but that's That's the yeah you you can't go to the School unless you're uh vaccinated Against I think that's That's a different country yeah but okay Would you want a country no America is Supposed to be the one that offers the Most Freedom that's what America is Supposed to be okay so watch so so so For example so for example if you use That argument so somebody may say well Freedom of choice I want to choose what I want to do with the body you're right If you want to get an abortion it's your Own body your own body if you want to Get an abortion get an abortion if I

Want to get the vaccine I get to choose So you can't force if I can't force you To get an abortion you shouldn't be able To force it because it's not about you It's about people you interact with and That's the social contract of public we Don't we don't even know if the vaccine Worked or not at the the time yes that's What the trials are dude that's why These childhood are you missing data out But but let me ask you a question are we Saying only one type of scientists are Right no we're saying that the system in Place the 16 000 that's signed up no no The system in place to test vaccines There's an entire system that's in place That that with review boards and all of It and the average that's in place now You can say you can what you can say is I I have a better idea than all these Review boards and all these agencies and The CDC I have a better idea here's what You should do and that would have made Everything better okay you can put forth That idea but what I'm saying is In a case where you can contaminate Someone else it's not about you it's About the collective you're assuming Health you're assuming you're assuming Because somebody can take the vaccine uh Won't get covered which by the way I Don't need to play the clips for you to See it where everybody said hey if you Get it you're not going to get if you

Take the vaccine you're not going to get A Rachel Maddow Joe Biden I can give you Fouche I can give you fit and you've Seen these clips before it's not like You've never seen it before yeah what Happened they were wrong hold on so So Um The Strain evolved Okay so that the vaccine that prevented You from Catching covid was tuned to the Variant of covid at the time the vaccine Was denied what was designed okay Over time there were variants that arose The vaccine provided partial protection Against the new variants enough to keep You from dying statistically and to Basically keep you out of the hospital Allowing other people with more severe Problems to get the hospital attention They required and so Then they would develop a a subsequent The booster and a subsequent mixture of The vaccine this is what happens every Year with a flu shot they look at how The flu has evolved from one season to The next and we have what's fortunate is Australia tends to get the variant of Flu before we do because they get their Winter in our summer and then so we Study that have a forward projection for It so that so these annual flu shots are Precisely out of the same idea of how This occurs how long have those been

Tested though for years covet vaccine Hasn't been tested for it it was a it Was something we just came out but let Me I don't know what points you're Making other than it was tested you Might nine months is not you might Prefer it's not a matter of time it's a Matter of it's a matter of how many yes Time matters but the number of people is Paramount that's the most important Thing okay you don't test it on 10 People as many people as you can sure I Think it was thousands but is it fair to Say that some of the side effects we may Not know for 5 10 15 20 years Um we you you can't like they can't say We know 100 the side effects 10 years From now how are you gonna know that Yeah okay so no of course we can't no so Then all I'm saying we can't know that Okay but watch Um So I have a whole chapter called risk And reward in the book which is tries to Get sensitized people to when they make A decision What kind of risk are they absorbing Relative to what they're rejecting okay And we're not very good at that at Probability and statistics or analyzing It that's why TV commercials trying to Sell you a product don't just show you With data they show a person speaking of The effectiveness of the product a

Single person I lost 50 pounds The testimony of an individual should be Irrelevant to you relative to the entire Set of people who have done it and you Want to look at those statistics but We're not good at that and advertisers Know that so they show the testimony of An individual which is hugely potent in A civilization where we don't think Statistically we think about eyewitness Testimony on something and somehow that Is is raised to very high level of Influence on our decisions what I'm Saying is you're not confirmed your Decision point is not I'm not going to Take the virus because five years ten Years I don't know what effect it's been It may though some may not be Comfortable let me finish the sentence You you Okay so you can say I don't want to take The virus because five or ten years from Now there could be a side effect that we Don't see which is a possibility hold on I'm trying to make a statistical Point Here okay If you say I don't want to take the Virus because it hasn't been tested for Five years and there could be some Long-term side effect that worries me Okay In that same moment There's the risk factor of you getting Coveted sure okay unvaccinated

80 at one point eighty seven percent of Everyone dying in the hospital of covid Was unvaccinated Okay so Your risk choice is I'm not going to Take it because maybe somewhere down the Line something will happen and we don't Know what that is or I will risk getting Covered and if I get covered depending On your age and other things there's a Three percent chance of me dying in the Hospital that's your choice Yes Yes but what I see people doing is they Focus on one thing and that's the Foundation of their decision but rather Than the other chance and what happens If you get covered now you get long Cover now you have a taste buds for for Two years or whatever it is for long Covet yeah um you're on a ventilator in The hospital possibly dying like what Where is the so I looked every day once A week I looked at the statistics how Many people are getting covered what's The rate what's the rate of Hospitalization what's the rate of Deaths where is it by State I had to Look at it my board enforcement or like We're in the business they should of Course because it's data yeah I agree on Risk factors the risk of people's lives Okay for sure so nothing is ever zero Risk

Yeah there's a risk that you'll grow a Third arm in 10 years because the virus Mutates within you what should the Individual should the individual not Have the right to say I don't want to Take it because you don't have the right To contaminate someone else so if you Don't again who says that though but who Says that it's a it's a it's a social Contract in a modern civilization I Don't have a republican I don't have the Right to contaminate someone else in What do you mean like so what do I do Stay home all day yeah or to go to the Beach yeah you stay you stay away from Other old people who you know stay away From people who are immune compromised So so Neil So for me I'm asking you Because I'm I want to know how you Process this as a guy that's well read Smart I process the data and the data But we didn't have enough data though no No we didn't have enough data at any Given moment yeah there's data for you To make a decision at any given moment Sure the data is constantly getting Better and better yeah all right so all Right at any given moment you say to Yourself okay Um Uh what happens to me if I get covered There's a chance I'll get long covered Uh I'm certainly out for at least a week Uh and there's a chance I'll be

Hospitalized and there's a chance I'll Die I take the vaccine It mitigates this Basically entirely removing the chance That I'm going to die essentially at my Age group and I will accept the risk That in five years I'll grow a third arm That's the kind of decision making that I make Now that's just for me but on top of That if my workplace says we don't want You coming in unless you are vaccinated And you might lose your job I would say Why oh because you could contaminate Someone else introducing a problem in Their own health profile That's the public contract that's why Workers wash their hands in the Restaurant bathrooms by law yes they are Required to do so because you don't want Poop germs in your dinner that they're Preparing because our evidence showed That that's one of the greatest places You can spread disease is in a Restaurant with a central kitchen so These are these are the this is the Now you want a world where you can do Whatever you want and have it influence Other people I'm not saying that you kind of are I'm Not saying that all I'm saying is the Following okay for example statistics uh You know have you seen the documentary

Died suddenly have you looked no no okay Well it's an interesting one it's on It's on I don't know where it's at you Can find it somewhere online yeah it's Got 30 million views I think it's worth Watching actually would be curious to Know what you say about it once you Watch it the statistic then showed like Pre-covered you know 29 people athletes In Europe died suddenly from heart Failure pre-covet pre-taking the MRNA Vaccine okay post taking mRNA vaccine Last year 500 people suddenly had heart failures In Europe and two-thirds died that's Documented that's not like it's a Hypothetical right okay you read Statistics like that then one has the Right to say just to be just to be Cheerful if you care about how you speak Information so so You are describing two events Okay you're describing events that had a Temporal relationship okay before you've Established a causal relationship just Be clear that that's 100 I'm not doing It all I'm doing is to follow it here's All I'm doing if if if if somebody all Of a sudden starts having a Breakout Meaning their skin starts breaking out You're 26 years old you never had a Breakout all of a sudden you start Breaking up and the doctor says listen Man what have you been doing differently

Well listen for the first time in my Life six weeks ago I started doing Deca Steroids well okay that's why it Implicates it right okay hey if somebody All of a sudden you know is having a Hard time sleeping at night yeah man I'm Having a very hard time so let's watch Your diet well then they notice at 10 30 At night you're having iced tea and you Know lemonade and you add it with this Well listen if we've been doing it for Six weeks that's why you have a hard Time just drop that don't drink that After two o'clock I'm just making you Know saying but all I'm saying is what I Want to know is I want to put everything On the table versus saying no no no There's one thing we can't put on the Table and that's the cause of the Vaccine there is no way there could be Any negative impact because of vaccine That's ludicrous has ever said that ever About anything if you say that then the Question then becomes back for you to Say when when covet first got started I Invited so many doctors to come in to Talk about covet and then I'm invited People on both sides I want both sides I Invited people from both sides you know Which side would never come The side that was for vaccine would Never ever come because they thought They were above the average person that Dane on the rest of us are dumb so

Because of that they're not willing to Come and sit down with Scientists I Think that's arrogant so to me when I Ask you scientific debate I'm not Telling you I'm a scientist hey let me Debate with you because I'm smarter I'm Not a scientist I'm I'm a business let's Let's do a hypothetical uh scenario Hypothetics are Um let's assume an actual cause and Effect has been has been established Okay in these in this case sure which Let's not have to see this film to know That it cause an effect other than a Coincidence in time relative to other Things that people might have been doing By the way alcohol consumption went up During covid significantly okay and Alcohol is implicated in heart disease So depression anxiety people staying at Home opioids addiction okay so though Staying at home wasn't the best decision Either what I'm saying is if after the Vaccine is available more people die of Heart failure over a time where alcohol Consumption went up as did that could be An option yeah that's right it's a very Good that's that's all I'm saying here But let's give it to you Let the vaccine cause this let's just Say that okay yeah and add it all up and You get what was it 1500 Post vaccine 29 To 1500 oh 20 29.

Thousands of deaths yeah okay Let's say ten thousand even Um All right uh You can estimate how many deaths The vaccine saved During covid Okay because you look at the death Numbers drop off as people got Vaccinated it's in the tens of Millions Again you can make a decision Uh do I not want to die from covid At this rate that occurred in this world Or do I not want to die from this Complication From the vaccine itself so make your Decision and so you'll say I might be in That 1500 so I'm not going to think then You get covered and die from covet right So you just make the decision you know What I would say to that we know what I Would say today what would you say Here's what I would say to that I would Say perfect let me take the risk and Thank you for giving it to me that way Versus telling me it's one or the other Which is Informed fully about what the risks are But like I said as a species we're not Very good at thinking statistically About we're just not and when we want to We believe we're going to be the Exception and look at the people betting On lotteries you know they think they're

Going to win but but for me but for me Like you know the moment they started uh Saying you have to put on cigarettes This the risk of this the risk of heart Failure cancer this this that and if you Still want to smoke cigarettes guess What you got a risk if you smoke Cigarettes you may get lung cancer right Hey if you eat this if you do this if You do that yes we've done guides your Admission to the bar There's a cost to that because it's a Public health issue and so right you are Free to smoke the cigarette but not in My establishment by law Not not in your establishment by law Correct no problem right totally fine But that's an example but if you want to Smoke cigarettes outside you can live on The beach unvaccinated that's fine Neil Let me ask you this so so what state Would you say was the most responsible During covet I like stats but I'm more financial I'm Not like you know you I understand what You're saying I'm a baseball guy so I Like Stephanie I'm all about stats I Love baseball so If we look at the stats The media made Florida seem the most Irresponsible State that's what the Media made it look okay we're in Florida Right now you you guys do have kind of a Bad rap bad reputation on a lot of stuff

Okay sure so and by the way I've lived In California 24 years five years in Texas two years in Florida okay so you Know my background that's right 10 years In around two years in Germany that's Kind of my background a couple years in The military but if we say hey if we Look at the data the most irresponsible State was Florida you would have heard Many Times News telling you that when I Go to California and I would say I'm in Florida I was like oh my God you're in Florida oh my God horrible but you know What I realize here's what I realized if The State of Florida is so bad Why did the MBA during black lives Matter host the playoffs in Florida I thought they created a bubble for Themselves but why did it come here they Could have done it in Texas Texas got Plenty places they could do it and why They do it here I don't know but the Point is they felt safest what I'm not Going to use the NBA as a measure of What is they would say I also did the Super Bowl here a lot of the Super Bowl Was here I'll give you another one Pro-vaccine AOC for vacation she came to Miami people from New York and California were partying for Miami During covet when everybody was looking For a home during Christmas where to go To you couldn't go to Colorado you Couldn't go to Lake Tahoe because it

Sucked you had all these other choices Everybody came to Florida I'm not gonna I can't use that as a statistics of Safety I can't uh I don't care who Chooses where to vacation I care what Your death rates are what your Vaccination rates are what your Hospitalization rates are that that Would be an objective measure from state To state where what state are you most Likely to die in from covid that's a Statistic I would pay attention to what State has the least hospital beds to Accommodate those who are sick from Covet even if they're not going to die From covet I would want to know that I'm Not going to base a decision on whether The NBA chose to put their bubble in the State well statistically in New York and California does not look good Statistically New York and California And they're supposed to be the most Responsible ones those two states didn't Look good all I'm saying is from my end In a space where I sit there and I Listen to you and I learn I say oh my Gosh look I had no clue about that that Was brilliant that's interesting let me Go research let me go look at this I'm a guy that likes debate of experts In two different sides and let them make The argument and I'm mature enough to Know the better salesman doesn't Necessarily have the better argument but

Let me just say that I'm there's nothing I've said in the last half hour that is A debating Point all I'm telling you but You can debate whether you should still Be able to work and put other workers at Risk for not having vaccinated that's a You can debate that yeah In the context of Public Health That's a risk factor that we don't want To introduce to other people because of Your decisions that's a public health Issue it's been going on basically for a Hundred and something years since you Know the uh the the what's the who's the Woman who uh some famous medic case a Person who spread what's it Uh what what is that case recently no no 100 years ago oh it created a whole wave Of sanitation rules and things for Public health sake but anyway the the Point is it's I want to make sure you Know you can focus on the 1500 people Who died after the vaccine Mary Mallon Talking about the history of typhoid Fever yep typhoon Mary yes thank you Yeah okay I didn't know her last name Yeah I thought typhoid was her first Name So uh so it's simply a matter of If you're saying you don't want to be in The 2000 whatever the number is who died After the vaccine from heart failure at The peak of your physical career Not totally necessarily factoring in all

The other abuses that went on over that Time that may have contributed to it Instead you want to take the risk of Covid and not be one of the 20 million People who would have died and didn't Right so so I just want you to have the Statistics in front of you and it seems To me most people would in most cases Choose the path That reduces their chance of death But by the way I don't disagree that's Why I'm not debating I'm putting it out There but this part of what you're Saying I'm I'm 100 with you but this is It's not a matter of being with me it's Just are you with no decision-making but What is a rational statistical but this Position is not an arrogant position This position is kind of like when You're sitting there and a doc and you Tell the doctor so doc what do I do do I Get to search like we have one of my Good friends right now is getting a Brain surgery in the next couple weeks She's she's afraid now she believes in God so faith is kind of common or down But she's afraid okay The doctor says there's a 10 chance You're not going to make it do you want To for the rest of your life live having To take that medication with the side Effects or do you want to do the surgery The individual is making a decision to Get the surgery she knows the chances is

What 10 you know what I say to that Hey at least I know the risk versus no If you take this you won't get anything Propaganda selling me this like what's The three things that you say there's Three different types of truth right It's objective truth personal truth and Political truth exactly that's the one I Have a problem with and I agree with you We all and that's the part I have a Problem with I I'm personal truth let's Debate have fun with it great let the Audience yeah yeah you want to debate Debate person exactly that's cool Kirker Picard you know yes whatever yes but That's a Star Trek reference dude who Let him in I'm sorry let him in they've Been asking that question for years The political truth I think is what Brought a lot of uh uh division in Households companies different places of Course I think that's what happened last Two and a half years specifically with That and you know this like you took it You didn't take it you're part of Political party like you may be Positioning me right statistically that Is the correct statement yeah Statistically it was but what was Interesting is that people with no College degree these uh Took the vaccine less than those with Bachelor's degrees but then MBA was the Least which is kind of funny MBA people

Took the least amount of activities yeah Interesting sociology statistics so if You like this clip and you want to watch Another one click right here and if you Want to watch the entire podcast click Right here

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